|
|
|
|
#1
02-16-2009, 08:05 PM
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
You don't think we could get a player who contributes in the 5th round? Or are you simply saying that we can't get a 5th round QB who would be as "dependable" as Sage? I think I could find a couple of 5th rounders who might compete for a starting position on this team, how sad is that? Bear Pascoe Matt Shaugnessy Lawrence Sidbury Corvey Irvin Dannel Ellerbe Cedric Peerman AQ Shipley CJ Spillman Andy Kemp Heck, Marlon Lucky is rated as undrafted and he'd probably add more into the W column than Sage.
__________________
Originally Posted by chuck I'm just sitting here thinking (pacing, actually) that whatever my issues with Kubiak he is apparently a goddam genius at tutoring quarterbacks. 
|
|
#2
02-16-2009, 09:13 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
As for Sage. Kubiak is coaching for his job, and our backup QB will be on the field next year if history is an indicator. Sage has shown himself to be a good NFL backup (no more, no less). We would be hard pressed to improve at that position if we dealt him, and we are not going to turn our team around next year for the 5th you guys advocate taking. If we had a young coach with a longer leash I'd say Sage is gone in the name of young talent. But as it is, I just don't see them pulling the trigger for a low round pick.
|
|
#3
02-16-2009, 11:25 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
2005 - LB Adam Seward 2006 - DE Mark Anderson 2007 - WR Aundae Allison and LB Tim Shaw 2008 - OT Carl Nicks Those were my 5th round picks over the last 5 years. They aren't Pro-Bowlers, except for Turner (I got lucky), but they were "My Guys" and I'll stand by them. The names that I threw out today were prospects that NFLDraft scout currently has listed as 5th rounders. Invariably, players that they rank as 3rd-4th round projects end up lasting until the 5th round. Turner was given a 2nd-3rd round grade, Seward 3-4th, Anderson 2-3rd, Allison a 3rd round grade and Shaw was ranked 3rd round. Carl Nicks had a 4th round grade after his off-field incident (he had been a 2nd round guy). Given that history, we could possibly end up with Eric Wood or Cody Brown in the 5th this year. As for getting another backup - Ramsey would be the 1st guy I'd look at. He knows the playbook and can hold his own. Just like Sage. I'm all for "just" trading down a couple slots to pick up late picks. Now if we can "just" find a willing trade partner to make that happen.
__________________
Originally Posted by chuck I'm just sitting here thinking (pacing, actually) that whatever my issues with Kubiak he is apparently a goddam genius at tutoring quarterbacks.
|
|
#4
02-16-2009, 09:35 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
If there's a guy we like in the 5th round, I'd rather just trade down 4 spots in the 1st and pick up a 3rd and a 5th... or, trade down in the second 3 spots and pick up a 5th. Makes a lot more sense than turning a strength (QB depth) into a weakness for pick #145 in the draft. By the way, how have these draft picks helped the team: Brandon Harrison Brandon Frye Frank Okam... those are our 5th rounders since 2006- I would not trade Sage Rosefels for any of those guys, and I was a huge fan of Brandon Frye going into last season.
|
|
#6
02-16-2009, 11:25 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
I'm the same guy who screamed insanity when people were calling for Sage to start of Schaub after the '07 season. I've got a very good idea who he is. The disagreement isn't about Sage's talent but about the importance of a backup QB. I think they're important. Some of you would trade a proven backup for a 5th round pick without worrying about what you'd replace him with. I find that ludicrous!
|
|
#7
02-17-2009, 08:42 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
1. Matt Cassel 2. Matt Leinart 3. Jeff Garcia 4. Derek Anderson 5. Byron Leftwich 6. Patrick Ramsey 7. Chris Simms 8. J.P. Losman 9. Brian Griese 10. Troy Smith 11. Billy Volek 12. Seneca Wallace 13. Kevin Kolb 14. Luke McCown 15. Josh McCown 16. Charlie Whitehurst 17. Brian Brohm
|
|
#8
02-17-2009, 09:03 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
that's a pathetic list.
outside of Cassell who is no longer a backup and Garcia who hasn't been for years there is not a QB better than Sage on there. Sage is a turnover machine. He forces throws that his arm don't allow him to get away with. The more he plays, the worse he does. When he starts, teams prepare for Sage he looks bad because they capitalize on his weaknesses. This is why he is a backup. Half of you arguing against him were calling for him to start back during the season. Roy was one of the only voices outside of my own who never trumpeted him over Schaub. But with that said, Sage moves a team up and down the field as well as any backup QB and better than many starters. The more he plays, the more the returns diminish, but he is a great guy to pull off the bench or to spot start. Additionally, it is obvious Kubiak likes him. I don't see him surrendering him for just a guy since he is coaching for his job this year.
|
|
#9
02-17-2009, 09:11 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
FYI, here is a pre-season list of the top backups by Don Banks of SI.com -
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...08/26/backups/ The list has some problems (like Cassell being left off because he thought he would get cut after a terrible preseason). However, Sage ranked 3rd (and that's probably about right). Nevertheless, there are several guys at the bottom that I think would perform well enough to warrant moving Sage if you could get something in return. I could get by with Tyler Thigpen, Matt Moore, Byron Leftwich, Ramsey, Boller or Frerotte.
|
|
#10
02-17-2009, 09:19 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
I think you're spot on with your analysis of Sage and he can move the ball in spot duty. However, the bottom line is he went 2-4 last year, with 1 win being a Rex Grossman special (a 16-6 win where Sage threw 2 picks). I don't see how anyone can think Sage had any significant impact on us winning games last year. And if he didn't, why is he so valuable?
|
|
#11
02-17-2009, 10:45 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
|
|
#12
02-17-2009, 12:14 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
In this year draft where we are picking, dropping down in the 1st is a smart move, not much difference in player #15 and player #40. But there are a lot of 2nd 3rd round guys. I am almost to the point of thinking about dropping out of this year 1st, and adding as many mid round guys as I can.
__________________
There is no failure, only feedback.
|
|
#13
02-17-2009, 08:58 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
I tend to agree with Keith that some may be overvaluing Sage's value in comparison with other potential backups. I pulled up Sage's game logs from last year to remind myself of what he did. Here's what he did, he went 2-3 as a starter and also played significant minutes in the Minnesota game (another loss). Why exactly is a guy who went 2-4 for us last year so valuable to the win column? While it is clearly speculation, had we traded Sage for the 3rd rounder and signed Leftwich, I don't think there is any way he would have been worse than 1-5 in Sage's place. At the very least, I think Leftwich would have won the Cleveland game, as we held them to 6 points and Sage didn't do us any favors by throwing 2 picks. Then, there's a very decent chance that Leftwich would have been as good or better.
The bottom line is that Sage didn't help us win last year. I think virtually any backup would have won the Cleveland game. Now, maybe Sage helped us win the Jacksonville game when another backup would not have, but, to me, that one game doesn't warrant turning down a 4th or 5 round pick, if you could get it. (Not to mention that another backup might not have turned into the Rosenchopter).
|
 |
| Bookmarks |
|
|
Hybrid Mode
