2009 needs

[NBT]

See, we do agree on some things PK. I fully agree with you on fatman Cody. Ton of talent, but lazy to a fault.

[painekiller]

Originally Posted by NBT

See, we do agree on some things PK. I fully agree with you on fatman Cody. Ton of talent, but lazy to a fault.

We agree more times then not. And sometimes we have to call each other out. Doesn't mean we don't still agree on most things.

[painekiller]

We need to upgrade the defense and fast. At the same time we need depth.

Playing with a list that will change before the draft I came up with a mock draft:
1 Orakpo DE
2 BJ Raji DT
3 Zack Follett LB
4 Nick Harris S
5 Ron Brace DT
6 Chase Daniel QB
7 Jorvorskie Lane RB/FB

DEs Williams, Cochran, Orakpo, Bulman, (Nading PS)
DTs Okoye, Johnson, Raji, Robinson, Brace
Lbs Adibi, Ryans, Diles, Follett, Bentley Coley
CBs Robinson, Reeves, Bennett, Molden
S Ferguson, Wilson, Harris, Barber,

Hey it's a young front 7, but they should be able to get to the RB.

[nero THE zero]

Raji's projected as a first rounder as it stands.

I actually think there's a better chance that Orakpo falls to the second than Raji. Orakpo's relatively weak against the run and seems to be maxed out in potential - a get-what-you-see type of guy. That's the kind of player that you can steal in the second (see: DeMeco Ryans)

[painekiller]

Originally Posted by nero THE zero

Raji's projected as a first rounder as it stands.

I actually think there's a better chance that Orakpo falls to the second than Raji. Orakpo's relatively weak against the run and seems to be maxed out in potential - a get-what-you-see type of guy. That's the kind of player that you can steal in the second (see: DeMeco Ryans)

I agree with you about Raji, but I was working with the current thehuddlereport.com rankings. It is a pay list and it always starts out way out of sorts.

On most of the list made prior to December Raji was ranked in the 40's, he is just now starting to be ranked by most list in the mid 20s, closer to where I believe him to be drafted. At this time last year Adibi was a 2nd rounder, and Chris Johnson was a 3rd or 4th rounder, so needless to say the list are all in a state of flux this time of year.

The main thing I want to show is we can really go heavy Defense and make a huge difference on this team, but it makes us even younger then we are now.

[nero THE zero]

Originally Posted by painekiller

The main thing I want to show is we can really go heavy Defense and make a huge difference on this team, but it makes us even younger then we are now.

Cheers to that.

I think we have to make some kind of impact FA signing on the defense, if not solely for the reason of getting some more leadership and experience in there. The list of probable FA DEs is looking pretty unspectacular, so I'm hoping a good LB hits the market. Plus, that way, we can focus our draft on DL/S.

[barrett]

Originally Posted by nero THE zero

Cheers to that.

I think we have to make some kind of impact FA signing on the defense, if not solely for the reason of getting some more leadership and experience in there. The list of probable FA DEs is looking pretty unspectacular, so I'm hoping a good LB hits the market. Plus, that way, we can focus our draft on DL/S.

rookie LBs and S make an impact in year 1. rookie DL rarely do. I'd rather our FA money was spent on the DL if anything is available. DL draft help won't get here in time to help this staff so I doubt we go that route.

[painekiller]

1 Orakpo DE That is a 1st day pick he is beating on this video
2 BJ Raji DT Against Notre Dame
3 Zack Follett LB Last years highlights
4 Nick Harris S
5 Ron Brace DT
6 Chase Daniel QB
7 Jorvorskie Lane RB/FB

A guy I would look real hard at for round 1

[Ol'Dad]

I do think that Lane out of Texas A&M is a great idea for somewhere in the 6th or 7th round. Really like the idea of him on first & goal.

[barrett]

Why would we spend a draft pick on a 300 lb RB. He came into this year knowing he had to work hard and make an impression on NFL scouts as a FB in order to get drafted. And then with all the motivation in the world, he actually went backwards and gained weight and had his worst season. You don't draft guys with no work ethic and limited upside.

If you want to sign him as a UFA I say fine, since their is no risk. But why throw away a pick on a guy who couldn't even be committed in college.

[nero THE zero]

Originally Posted by barrett

Why would we spend a draft pick on a 300 lb RB. He came into this year knowing he had to work hard and make an impression on NFL scouts as a FB in order to get drafted. And then with all the motivation in the world, he actually went backwards and gained weight and had his worst season. You don't draft guys with no work ethic and limited upside.

If you want to sign him as a UFA I say fine, since their is no risk. But why throw away a pick on a guy who couldn't even be committed in college.

Because he went to A&M. Duh.

[papabear]

Originally Posted by Ol'Dad

I do think that Lane out of Texas A&M is a great idea for somewhere in the 6th or 7th round. Really like the idea of him on first & goal.

I might be willing to give it a shot in the 7th round. Even as a UT fan, Lane's always frustrated the hell out of me. I wonder if he wouldn't have been batter off going to DE like Melton did at Texas. I know he was asked to lose weight at A&M and gained it instead. My guess is there will be some questions about his attitude and work ethic going to the NFL.

[kRocket]

The more games we win the further down the ladder at draft day we are falling. What used to be 8+ has now dropped to 13 and falling. The premium players are more than likely gone by now. WalterFootball has us taking William Moore, but 2 slots following us is Brandon Spikes. He is a MLB, and could be a good one. I believe this defense is 1-2 players away from jelling.

Question: Can DeMeco move to OLB effectively? And, Do you guys think Brandon Spikes could be one of our answers?

[barrett]

Originally Posted by painekiller

1 Orakpo DE That is a 1st day pick he is beating on this video
2 BJ Raji DT Against Notre Dame
3 Zack Follett LB Last years highlights
4 Nick Harris S
5 Ron Brace DT
6 Chase Daniel QB
7 Jorvorskie Lane RB/FB

A guy I would look real hard at for round 1

With the motivation of NFL dollars, Lane just showed up for the shrine game 5'10" and 295.

[edo783]

Originally Posted by barrett

With the motivation of NFL dollars, Lane just showed up for the shrine game 5'10" and 295.

Now that is a BIG running back. Talk about eating yourself out of the league.

[NBT]

Originally Posted by painekiller

We need to upgrade the defense and fast. At the same time we need depth.

Playing with a list that will change before the draft I came up with a mock draft:
1 Orakpo DE
2 BJ Raji DT
3 Zack Follett LB
4 Nick Harris S
5 Ron Brace DT
6 Chase Daniel QB
7 Jorvorskie Lane RB/FB

DEs Williams, Cochran, Orakpo, Bulman, (Nading PS)
DTs Okoye, Johnson, Raji, Robinson, Brace
Lbs Adibi, Ryans, Diles, Follett, Bentley Coley
CBs Robinson, Reeves, Bennett, Molden
S Ferguson, Wilson, Harris, Barber,

Hey it's a young front 7, but they should be able to get to the RB.

Orakpo just won the Lombardi Award. He is projected to go in the top 10, if not the top 5. Do you advocate a tradeup to get Orakpo, PK? We will most likely draft from 12 to about the number 18 spot we held last year. I know I have steadfastly lobbied against trading up in the past, but this JUST might be the exception to the rule. BUT then we wouldn't be able to draft Raji, whom I have come to covet like you do.

[nero THE zero]

Originally Posted by NBT

Orakpo just won the Lombardi Award. He is projected to go in the top 10, if not the top 5. Do you advocate a tradeup to get Orakpo, PK? We will most likely draft from 12 to about the number 18 spot we held last year. I know I have steadfastly lobbied against trading up in the past, but this JUST might be the exception to the rule. BUT then we wouldn't be able to draft Raji, whom I have come to covet like you do.

I would bet my house Orakpo isn't a top 5 pick. To the contrary, I would put good money that he falls to the late first or second round.

His frame is essentially maxed out, meaning he doesn't have that high ceiling potential a lot of early first rounders have. He also is relatively weak against the run. You get what you see with him, but he's not a guy that's going to put on 10 more pounds of muscle or someone who's still reaching his potential. For that reason, I think he's much more likely to fall.

[papabear]

Originally Posted by nero THE zero

I would bet my house Orakpo isn't a top 5 pick. To the contrary, I would put good money that he falls to the late first or second round.

His frame is essentially maxed out, meaning he doesn't have that high ceiling potential a lot of early first rounders have. He also is relatively weak against the run. You get what you see with him, but he's not a guy that's going to put on 10 more pounds of muscle or someone who's still reaching his potential. For that reason, I think he's much more likely to fall.

I don't know if he's maxed out or not, but I have heard some people propose moving him to LB.

[barrett]

Originally Posted by nero THE zero

I would bet my house Orakpo isn't a top 5 pick. To the contrary, I would put good money that he falls to the late first or second round.

His frame is essentially maxed out, meaning he doesn't have that high ceiling potential a lot of early first rounders have. He also is relatively weak against the run. You get what you see with him, but he's not a guy that's going to put on 10 more pounds of muscle or someone who's still reaching his potential. For that reason, I think he's much more likely to fall.

I don't know where he goes in the draft, but you are making this stuff up. His frame won't hurt him at all. I ask you which pass rushing DE fell after his senior season for being 260?

260 is plenty big to rush the passer in the NFL. Not to mention he is 6'4". That makes him bigger than either of the Colts great DEs Freeney and Mathis.

Orakpo may fall, I don't know enough about him to say either way, and it will depend on the combine for him like anyone else. But it won't have anything to do with being too small.

[nero THE zero]

Originally Posted by barrett

I don't know where he goes in the draft, but you are making this stuff up. His frame won't hurt him at all. I ask you which pass rushing DE fell after his senior season for being 260?

260 is plenty big to rush the passer in the NFL. Not to mention he is 6'4". That makes him bigger than either of the Colts great DEs Freeney and Mathis.

Orakpo may fall, I don't know enough about him to say either way, and it will depend on the combine for him like anyone else. But it won't have anything to do with being too small.

Show me where I said he's too small. You're mischaracterizing my argument.

He's not a "natural" 260. He's very cut and bulked up, but his frame is maxed out. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but I am saying that's something I think will make him more prone to falling than players who have a bigger perceived upside.