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  #1  
Old 02-23-2009, 10:26 PM
kravix kravix is offline
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I dont really understand this or agree with it.

While Weaver has under performed his contract, ok way under performed, he is still the second best DE on the roster IMO. While his pass rushing skill are very suspect, which he was never advertised as having, he can play the run.

$800k in savings? Might as well bring the guy into camp and let him compete. This does nothing more than free up a roster spot, which at this point doesnt need to be freed up.

This move has overpaid, underperforming, FA splash written all over it.

So we know the defence wants to be more agressive, maybe react and read rather than read and react. We know the team wants to generate more pressure on the QB than just MW. Now we need an every down DE, preferably one that can actually play the run also. I have no desire to see the next Freeney rack up sacks and let teams run all over us killing playoff run after playoff run. Plus our off, while very good this year, is still not an Off I would count on to put the opposing team into a single dimension passing team.

So, who is out there that can actually play a 4-3 DE, stop the run and generate some pressure? I wouldnt imagine we see another monster DE like MW, but at least someone solid in both areas.
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  #2  
Old 02-23-2009, 10:36 PM
dalemurphy dalemurphy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kravix View Post
I dont really understand this or agree with it.

While Weaver has under performed his contract, ok way under performed, he is still the second best DE on the roster IMO. While his pass rushing skill are very suspect, which he was never advertised as having, he can play the run.

$800k in savings? Might as well bring the guy into camp and let him compete. This does nothing more than free up a roster spot, which at this point doesnt need to be freed up.

This move has overpaid, underperforming, FA splash written all over it.

So we know the defence wants to be more agressive, maybe react and read rather than read and react. We know the team wants to generate more pressure on the QB than just MW. Now we need an every down DE, preferably one that can actually play the run also. I have no desire to see the next Freeney rack up sacks and let teams run all over us killing playoff run after playoff run. Plus our off, while very good this year, is still not an Off I would count on to put the opposing team into a single dimension passing team.

So, who is out there that can actually play a 4-3 DE, stop the run and generate some pressure? I wouldnt imagine we see another monster DE like MW, but at least someone solid in both areas.

No way Weaver is better than Cochran or Bulman at DE. Also, we have guys like Stanley McGlover and Chaun Thompson who are coming off injury-riddled seasons that are better fits for that position... oh yeah, and Nading. Plus, we'll be drafting 1-2 DEs. I don't think this signals a FA splash written on it at all.

By the way, the cap savings is $800,000, however the organization is saving close to $3 million by not paying him his salary this year.

And, it's obnoxious to compare Dwight Freeney unfavorably to Anthony Weaver, which is basically what you've done. The reason Indy struggles against the run is because every member of their DL weigh about 250 lbs, including the tackles. That's their problem- not Freeney. Check out Philadelphia, or Tennessee, who both use smaller DEs and are excellent stopping the run.

It's about time this organization demanded that the FAs and veterans perform up to their salaries. The only thing that could make this off-season better, to this point, would be to see Kasey Studdard given his walking papers.
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  #3  
Old 02-23-2009, 10:56 PM
kravix kravix is offline
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Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
And, it's obnoxious to compare Dwight Freeney unfavorably to Anthony Weaver, which is basically what you've done. The reason Indy struggles against the run is because every member of their DL weigh about 250 lbs, including the tackles. That's their problem- not Freeney. Check out Philadelphia, or Tennessee, who both use smaller DEs and are excellent stopping the run.
Bringing Freeny and Weaver up in the same post in no way compares the two. My statement about Freeney had nothing to do with Weaver, it was about the idea that pass rush > run defense, and lighning fast, light in the butt, every down DE only trades one weakness for another.

I compared Freeney to every undersized pass rushing DE in FA or the draft, now that you can slap me for.

I like Bulman and Cochran. It would be nice if either were great players. At this point Cochran may get a chace a starting position somewhere if the Texans dont tender him. I am all for waiting for DL talent to mature also, but still dont think that either of them has the talent Weaver has.

Thompson is a LB and situational pass rusher at best, and McClover is a 7th round pick that has shown less than Bulman or Cochran at this point.
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  #4  
Old 02-23-2009, 11:57 PM
Roy P Roy P is offline
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I am still wondering if we could pry Jeremy Thompson away from Green Bay since they are converting to a 3-4 defense under dandy Dom. Me likes the idea of getting rid of Weaver, Greenwood, and Sage. It allows the team to get younger, and hopefully better.
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  #5  
Old 02-24-2009, 12:04 AM
mussop mussop is offline
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Maybe we are close to getting Peppers and that makes Weaver expendable.
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  #6  
Old 02-24-2009, 09:55 AM
papabear papabear is offline
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Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
No way Weaver is better than Cochran or Bulman at DE.
Against the run they aren't. I really like Cochran and I would like to see him develop more. I'm not upset that Weaver's gone by any means, but for a minimal cap savings I don't see the point when he could still be a situational guy for us. Maybe McNAir didn't want to pay the salary, and that's fine with me too. I tend to lean towards the idea that tried to rework his contract and he said no.
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  #7  
Old 02-24-2009, 10:00 AM
WMH WMH is offline
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Peppers isn't going to happen...Or at least I hope it doesn't. Since he was franchised, we would need to give up...2 1sts(?), not too mention the contract that he would demand. I would love to have the guy, but not at the expense of 2 1sts.
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  #8  
Old 02-24-2009, 10:03 AM
papabear papabear is offline
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Originally Posted by WMH View Post
Peppers isn't going to happen...Or at least I hope it doesn't. Since he was franchised, we would need to give up...2 1sts(?), not too mention the contract that he would demand. I would love to have the guy, but not at the expense of 2 1sts.
They can work out a trade that doesn't have to be two first. I still don't see it happening though.
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  #9  
Old 02-24-2009, 10:05 AM
dalemurphy dalemurphy is offline
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Originally Posted by papabear View Post
Against the run they aren't. I really like Cochran and I would like to see him develop more. I'm not upset that Weaver's gone by any means, but for a minimal cap savings I don't see the point when he could still be a situational guy for us. Maybe McNAir didn't want to pay the salary, and that's fine with me too. I tend to lean towards the idea that tried to rework his contract and he said no.
Deion Sanders wasn't as good against the run as Marcus Coleman... However, I think I'd take Deion at CB anyway. I know that analogy is a little ridiculous but the point is that playmaking ability and a pass rush are the primary duties for a DE. Particularly with Mario on one side, we just need a guy that can get to the QB- the other edge is set. Our run defense will improve when our DTs do.
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  #10  
Old 02-24-2009, 10:14 AM
papabear papabear is offline
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Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
Deion Sanders wasn't as good against the run as Marcus Coleman... However, I think I'd take Deion at CB anyway. I know that analogy is a little ridiculous but the point is that playmaking ability and a pass rush are the primary duties for a DE. Particularly with Mario on one side, we just need a guy that can get to the QB- the other edge is set. Our run defense will improve when our DTs do.
I agree on the DT line, but the Strongside DE always has more responsibility against the run. I wasn't reffering to an every down situation either. My point was I can see Weaver in on short yardage situations. and as part of a rotation. Not that he's a great every down DE. He's making way to much money for that, I know, but he's not completely useless on the field depsite what the sack numbers say.
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  #11  
Old 02-25-2009, 02:17 PM
WMH WMH is offline
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It is now official. Along with Weaver, Salaam, and Demps got the axe.

From Chron.com:
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/6280713.html
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  #12  
Old 02-25-2009, 02:21 PM
Arky Arky is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WMH View Post
It is now official. Along with Weaver, Salaam, and Demps got the axe.

From Chron.com:
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/6280713.html
Man, talk about your spring cleaning..... gonna be a lot a new faces in 2009....
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  #13  
Old 02-24-2009, 01:42 AM
painekiller painekiller is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kravix View Post
I dont really understand this or agree with it.

While Weaver has under performed his contract, ok way under performed, he is still the second best DE on the roster IMO.
I would say Cochrin when healthy is the #2 best DE on the team. And Bulman and Nading are making themselves nice rotation guys.

BTW I can't find Dan Bazuin on the roster and I do not see him being cut anywhere, he must be cut and the official site just missed the transaction.
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