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  #21  
Old 11-19-2008, 07:19 AM
KJ3 KJ3 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by painekiller View Post
We do not have defensive playmakers on this team.
hard for demeco to make a play when manning throws at reeves all day.

i don't think the switch to 3/4 would be all that bad. jeez, i mean it can't get much worse. what exactly would we be back tracking from?
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  #22  
Old 11-19-2008, 12:42 PM
NBT NBT is offline
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PK-"Personally I think the players are 70% of the problem and that coaching is 30% of the problem. Coaches do not miss tackles or not locate the ball in the air. We do not have defensive playmakers on this team."

How about the percentage that could be considered bad game planning, game management, etc.? Who's fault is that?
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  #23  
Old 11-19-2008, 01:45 PM
papabear papabear is offline
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Originally Posted by nunusguy View Post
Okaye and Travis both definitely not fits as DLineman in the 3-4, but many people feel Mario is the prototype 3-4 DE and that's what Weaver played before coming over here, but I think its been established that Weaver is too expensive at any position with his present cap. But Bullman looks like a real
fit as a 3-4 end, but we'd still need a NT ?
You were joking about Cochran as an OLB ?
I think Mario could play DE in a 3-4, but I think you are limiting on of your best players by having him play there. The 3-4 is set up for the OLB. I think your wasting some of Mario's talents by moving to that scheme. Remember one of the arguments for the Weaver signing was that he would be much more productive than his 14.5 sacks in 57 games once he moved to the 4-3. Weaver might be a bad example because he hasn't been productive in a 4-3 either, but the point remains the same. Why take your best player and put him in a role that is not designed to make plays.

I've heard others say Mario could be an OLB in a 3-4. That would be fine on rushing downs, but as good an athelete as he is he simply isn't going to hav the skillset he needs in coverage. He would be a beast if they could make it work, but I think we'd end up giving up the element of surprise the 3-4 relies on and just end up sending Mario as the fourth rusher every play.

It's all academic anyway, because if you don't have the right NT in a 3-4 nothing else matters.
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  #24  
Old 11-19-2008, 02:01 PM
painekiller painekiller is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NBT View Post
PK-"Personally I think the players are 70% of the problem and that coaching is 30% of the problem. Coaches do not miss tackles or not locate the ball in the air. We do not have defensive playmakers on this team."

How about the percentage that could be considered bad game planning, game management, etc.? Who's fault is that?
30% of the trouble with the defense is coaching, IMO.

We are not in the meetings with the players, so we do not see Kubiak and Co. get on the players for the same mistakes over and over again. But I did see Kubiak say What the F**K was that on Sunday. So I know he chews the players and coaches out. He has the passion and he has the back of the players and coaches in public.

I know you all want a break down and he getting mad, but that is not going to happen until he looses this team, and then it's over.

Changing coaches mid year is a stupid move, it only leads to more second guessing.
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  #25  
Old 11-19-2008, 07:22 PM
edo783 edo783 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by painekiller View Post
Changing coaches mid year is a stupid move, it only leads to more second guessing.
Yup, in most cases. I might be persuaded to do it and put Bush at the controls to see if it makes a difference at this point.
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  #26  
Old 11-20-2008, 01:16 AM
painekiller painekiller is offline
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Problems with our coaching staff? Kubiak's insistence on going with the old Denver system of using a smaller OL will be a problem. We already are seeing the results of a smaller OC, NT can be disruptive. I want to scream everytime I read someone's complaint about Myers being pushed back in pass blocking. Go watch the Denver games from a last years of Elway. They had same trouble. BTW, Shanahan has dropped the smaller OL in Denver the last few years. He is now looking at going with a larger OL but still using a ZBS.

Another one to chew on, our defense is utilizing a smaller front 7. Every one of the guys we have in the front 7 is undersized for his position, a 305 NT and a 290 DT. But they are not being asked to penetrate on every play. Penetration disrupts offenses more than anything else you can do. So shot a gap on everyplay and have every gap covered.
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  #27  
Old 11-20-2008, 08:42 AM
papabear papabear is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by painekiller View Post
Problems with our coaching staff? Kubiak's insistence on going with the old Denver system of using a smaller OL will be a problem. We already are seeing the results of a smaller OC, NT can be disruptive. I want to scream everytime I read someone's complaint about Myers being pushed back in pass blocking. Go watch the Denver games from a last years of Elway. They had same trouble. BTW, Shanahan has dropped the smaller OL in Denver the last few years. He is now looking at going with a larger OL but still using a ZBS.

Another one to chew on, our defense is utilizing a smaller front 7. Every one of the guys we have in the front 7 is undersized for his position, a 305 NT and a 290 DT. But they are not being asked to penetrate on every play. Penetration disrupts offenses more than anything else you can do. So shot a gap on everyplay and have every gap covered.
The Zone system in Denver was successful early on because it was different. Once teams had a chance to figure it out it lost some of it's effectiveness. Penetration will disrupt any scheme you can come up with though. I still think the zone system can be effective, but your right in that Kubiak will have to learn to adjust with it. I think that all offensive lineman these days are more "athletic" than they were 20 years ago so I think there are plenty of O-lineman today who could work in ZB system that don't fall into that undersized lineman mold. It goes beyond personnel though, Kubiak/Gibbs have to be willing to throw in a few wrinkles in the scheme. I actually liked that we mixed in some of Sherman's "power" scheme last year and was hoping we would at least keep an element or two of it in place. We're running the ball better than last year, but that has a lot to do with Slaton.

I've always wondered why we seem to have our DT's playing with so much two gap responsibility instead of letting them penetrate. I suppose it's in an effort to keep Demeco clean, but Okoye and Travis Johnson are both both better suited as one gap players who penetrate. I prefer to have a mammoth NT and then let the other guys on the line be the quicker penetrating types. That mammoth NT-type will never be TJ, and Okam isn't that guy yet so I they might as well turn'em loose.

I have no problem with undersized LB's....especially with the amount of coverage they have to do, but if your LB's and D-Line are both undersized then your going to have problems against the run. See Indianapolis. Right now we have all the disadvantages of an undersized front 7 without any of the advantages in the pass rushing department. One reason for that is not using the personnel we have properly IMO, but it's not the only one.
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  #28  
Old 11-20-2008, 02:24 PM
NBT NBT is offline
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When there is a problem, at least 70% or better is going to be the players fault, because they play the games. BUT if the coaching staff gives them a B.S. gameplan, then that is the time when 30% is greater than 70%, at least in my mind. Trains won't run well without good tracks.
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  #29  
Old 11-21-2008, 02:28 PM
Keith Keith is offline
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Well, Hoke must really suck because now Richard Justice is endorsing him as the new DC in his blog.
Quote:
Maybe a new and improved defensive coordinator is already on the staff. Maybe all he needs is a chance. I'd be stunned if Jon Hoke couldn't do a great job.

He's in charge of the defensive backs. He has stayed despite several job offers through the years. He worked for Steve Spurrier, who is as good as anyone at dealing with players. He's close with Bob Stoops, too, and has some of his fire.
http://blogs.chron.com/sportsjustice...rown_buil.html

About three years ago, I would have agreed with Justice. Maybe Hoke is not much of a Kubiak guy? Dunno.
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  #30  
Old 11-23-2008, 03:08 PM
NBT NBT is offline
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Richard Justice don't know squat!
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