Mario Trade Idea

[itssharif]

I've seriously been thinking about this and I think we oughta just franchise and trade Mario while Philly franchises and trades DeSean Jackson. We'd get our #2 WR/PR that we'd want at a much lower cap cost as resigning DeSean Jackson probably would be around 10-12 mil whereas resigning Mario would be around 15-18 mil towards the cap. I dunno I just feel like everything is win win for everybody involved.

[Joshua]

Originally Posted by itssharif

I've seriously been thinking about this and I think we oughta just franchise and trade Mario while Philly franchises and trades DeSean Jackson. We'd get our #2 WR/PR that we'd want at a much lower cap cost as resigning DeSean Jackson probably would be around 10-12 mil whereas resigning Mario would be around 15-18 mil towards the cap. I dunno I just feel like everything is win win for everybody involved.

So, we get rid of a homegrown top flight player at one of the most important positions on the field for a No. 2 receiver with an attitude problem? And we do this simply to save 3 or 4 million? Which could easily be backloaded for when the cap explodes in 2 years? And run the risk of alienating other guys in the lockerroom who think the front office don't take care of their own when the time comes (which has already been an issue under Rick Smith)? To me, that makes no sense. I could (somewhat) understand if you let Mario walk because you don't want to tie that much money up in one guy. However, to let him walk just to turn around and tie up most of the money in a 160 lb. decoy with a chip on his shoulder does not sound good to me.

Something else I've been thinking about Desean is whether he could be the same player here. For instance, some of his most explosive plays have been when Vick hit him on a rope, in stride, waaaaaayyyy down field. That will not happen here. Schaub simply doesn't have the arm for it. In Philly, you had to be on top of Desean for at least 50-60 yards from the line of scrimmage. Here, you'd only have to cover him for about 40 or so yards. Not sure how much difference this makes, but I don't think it makes no difference.

[popanot]

Originally Posted by Joshua

So, we get rid of a homegrown top flight player at one of the most important positions on the field for a No. 2 receiver with an attitude problem? And we do this simply to save 3 or 4 million? Which could easily be backloaded for when the cap explodes in 2 years? And run the risk of alienating other guys in the locker room who think the front office don't take care of their own when the time comes (which has already been an issue under Rick Smith)? To me, that makes no sense. I could (somewhat) understand if you let Mario walk because you don't want to tie that much money up in one guy. However, to let him walk just to turn around and tie up most of the money in a 160 lb. decoy with a chip on his shoulder does not sound good to me.

Not sure I get this logic... It's OK to let him walk and basically send the message to the locker room that you don't want to pay the guy and will just let him go for nothing, but it's sending the wrong message by signing him and trading him for someone of value who could help improve the team?

Looking back, the only nasty contract haggle I can recall that Rick Smith had was with DRob, and much of that was DRob's fault (and I don't think anyone had a problem with letting him walk at that point). So historically, Smith has shown he'll take care of his players based on his dealings with Demeco and Daniels (and as I recall, they both were coming off injuries). I don't think it will cause a locker room rift if they sign and trade Mario. Whether it's the right move or wrong move, it's still smart business to get something for him if you don't plan on paying him all that money and the players have to understand that (you hope).

Let me give you this scenario... What if they trade Mario's ~$18M salary for Jackson's $~10M salary and used the 'savings' to take care of Foster, Meyers, Brisel and Dressen, and in addition, not have to cut Demeco or Walter or cut some "aging veteran's" salary? I doubt the locker room would have a problem with it if that happened.

As for Jackson, I highly doubt he'd be just a decoy. Not mention his amazing PR skills, I'm fairly certain he'd get his receptions and would definitely make AJ and Schaub's job easier. As for his pouting, yeah I didn't like that either (and the Eagles are my 2nd fav team having grown up in that area), but up until that point, he's been a model player and citizen who has done a lot in the Philly community. Not that it necessarily justifies the way he acted, but I think he got some really bad advice from his agent (the holdout) and was deeply hurt when the Eagles started signing all those FA's and didn't want to talk to him about an extension. Yes, he handled it poorly (at 26 years old), but I don't think he's a prima donna by any stretch. Hell, I don't know... I do know his talent would be huge for this team, though.

[barrett]

If you can take care of foster, myers, brisel, and dreesen for $8 million, then you are a cap wizard and you have no need to get rid of Mario.

As for your scenario, it is great fun to imagine all the riches we can get for Mario. I am sure when the team makes a decision they will know whether he can be flipped for multiple 1st round picks or desean Jackson. And I am sure that will all be a consideration in the process.

[popanot]

Originally Posted by barrett

If you can take care of foster, myers, brisel, and dreesen for $8 million, then you are a cap wizard and you have no need to get rid of Mario.

As for your scenario, it is great fun to imagine all the riches we can get for Mario. I am sure when the team makes a decision they will know whether he can be flipped for multiple 1st round picks or desean Jackson. And I am sure that will all be a consideration in the process.

I guess I should have been more clear with my comment. I forgot the and/or and meant to say if they can sign one or more of those guys. I don't think it's that far fetched to say they could use that ~$8MM to sign a combo of Meyers, Brisel and/or Dressen. Maybe Foster's out of that equation depending on what they want to do with his contract this year.

As for trading Mario for Jackson, I'm not the one who brought it up and was merely playing along in the thread. Do I think that trade would ever go down? Hell no! Mostly likely none of these player/player trades would ever go down and certainly not one for two major players (let alone two F-Tag players). Realistically, I think the Texans will be lucky if they can get a low 2012 #1, or a player and a pick, or two #2's for Mario.

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, I'd like to see them try to get Cobb and a #2 from GB. I think that would be a realistic trade and I think GB is in a situation where they'd have to think long and hard about it. I also think GB is a team Mario would be receptive to being traded to since they're pretty damn good. I know they (at least, currently) run a 3-4, but their D was so bad last year I could see them making some changes and I don't think they'd pass up a pass-rushing defensive talent like Mario. Especially for the price of Cobb and a low #2.

Anyway, who knows what will happen? It's still fun to speculate and throw out names and be a pocket GM/Capologist for a day.

[WMH]

Originally Posted by popanot

I mentioned in this thread, I'd like to see them try to get Cobb and a #2 from GB. I think that would be a realistic trade and I think GB is in situation where they'd have to think long and hard about it. I also think it would be a team Mario would be receptive to since they're pretty damn good. I know they (currently) run a 3-4, but their D was so bad last year I could see some changes being made and I don't think they'd pass up a pass-rusher with Mario's talent. Anyway, who know what will happen? It still fun to speculate and throw names out and be a GM/Capologist for a day.

Only downside to your GB scenario is the vast differences between Wade's 3-4 and just about every other 3-4 out there. Hard for me to remember, since I drank away most of those games, but I believe that Capers 3-4 is more of the traditional variety, IE Mario would definitely be a square peg in a round hole, and he might not be worth the cash as a 3-4 DE in a "traditional" system.

[NBT]

As for keeping Mario because of his passrush ability, that would be allright, but certainly not mandatory now that we have Connor Barwin, Brooks Reed, and J.J. Watt to do that for us. No, I think our best bet would be to franchise Mario and get the best pass reciever/PR available, which would appear to be DeSean Jackson and whoever we can get out of the Draft.

[popanot]

Originally Posted by WMH

Only downside to your GB scenario is the vast differences between Wade's 3-4 and just about every other 3-4 out there. Hard for me to remember, since I drank away most of those games, but I believe that Capers 3-4 is more of the traditional variety, IE Mario would definitely be a square peg in a round hole, and he might not be worth the cash as a 3-4 DE in a "traditional" system.

Very valid points. However, with a guru like Capers, I bet he'd be able to find a role for him whether it be at OLB or a 3-4 DE. Actually, I'd be surprised if Capers isn't on this thin ice up there, and at minimum, is forced to make some changes with the scheme and certainly the personnel. That D was about as bad as it gets and certainly was a major factor in losing that playoff game.

I just tossed out that trade idea b/c I thought it'd be a good match value-wise. There are other young and talented WR/PRs out there (Denarius Moore, Maclin, Harvin, etc...), but I don't think the teams are as deep and have the luxury of giving them up, or, they're just not good trade partners. For example, MINN probably wouldn't give up Harvin (same with PHL/Maclin) and I wouldn't want to trade with an AFC team, if at all possible. However, I could see GB willing to give up Cobb since they're so deep at WR and see Mario as pretty good value there.

[itssharif]

Originally Posted by barrett

If you can take care of foster, myers, brisel, and dreesen for $8 million, then you are a cap wizard and you have no need to get rid of Mario.

As for your scenario, it is great fun to imagine all the riches we can get for Mario. I am sure when the team makes a decision they will know whether he can be flipped for multiple 1st round picks or desean Jackson. And I am sure that will all be a consideration in the process.

Also you have to remember that the cap goes up every year. If it goes up let's say 7 mil this year you're looking at an additional 15 mil dollars in this scenario.

As far as the Mario situation look if it's up to me I'd hate to see him go. He is match-up nightmare for defenses and could make our defense even better. But honestly we have to start thinking now about the greater good and the specialness that is happening right before our eyes with our Texans and that is the team chemistry and camaraderie that is needed for successful TEAMS to develop. If we lose 1 player to gain another and use that extra money towards keeping our core group of guys it'll be an overall plus for our team.

Lastly this topic of headcases and people attacking me for suggesting DeSean Jackson. Who the hell is ok with losing? Nobody. DeSean Jackson probably was pissed last year but because they were not doing the things they should have been doing (WINNING). Compound that with not getting paid when he definitely deserved it I'm sure it must have been a tough situation for him. But you show me one person that could make an argument to me that if he replaced Jacoby Jones in our locker room this offseason that this wouldn't be a better move. Is he going to be as productive a #2 receiver for us as he was for Philly probably not because Michael Vick definitely does have a rifle for an arm and can throw DeSean open definitely. But you can't say this guy can't still be a threat for whichever team he plays on.

It's just a suggestion but I sincerely believe this would be a tremendous upgrade for us, lower our cap number, get us out of this Jacoby Jones lottery of whether or not he will field the punt or not, and finally give Schaub a legitimate #2. Finally last but not least this is an incredibly realistic scenario AND trust me winning cures all, which is all that the Texans will hopefully be doing from now on. DeSean Jackson will be just fine getting paid and seeing the W's come to the team's way.

And that's just my take!

[cadams]

this draft is supposedly very deep at the WR position. if we trade mario the i sure as hell don't want it to be for a wide receiver wanting a new big contract. i was on the fence about mario before, but the mroe i think about it the more i want them to keep him around long term, my guess is they will, and will get creative with contract guarentees to take advantage of the incvreasing cap over the next few years.

for anyone suggesting that foster may have to wait another year, i think that would be the worst possible result of any scenario you could throw out. before the season, bob mcnair told foster and his agent that if he followed up last year with another solid year (which he did), they would take care of him. if they try to push him off it could have an impact not only on foster (holding out), but in future negotiations with players. when the owner makes a statement like that, it HAS to be honored.

[WMH]

I'm wondering if applying the tag is a game they will play. A tag @ $22ishMM is not something they can absorb. If they apply it, and don't find a trade partner, the agent/Mario has no reason whatsoever to "make a deal." He then has the Texans by the balls. If they reach a stalemate, some pretty significant folks might have to get the ax to get under the cap. Other teams know the same scenario, so why would they want to give up a package of now affordable picks for a guy they know the Texans can't afford without chopping some significant heads. Pretty dangerous game if you ask me.

They might make a legimate effort to keep him around, without applying the tag. If it doesn't work, then he walks.

He walks, the Texans not only have money for Foster, Myers, and Dressen, but could also be in play for a lower-upper tier FA WR.

Food for thought on this dreary, rainy, Wednesday morning.

[popanot]

And let me just add, I don't have a problem with them keeping Mario as long as they can do a new contract that is good for both him and the team. If they sign him to the F-Tag $, well then I guess we'll just have to live with it. What I don't want to have happen is just letting him walk and getting nothing in return. I mean, this isn't Carr or DRob where you don't care if they walk. Of course, a lot of this depends on Mario and him being receptive to a sign and trade deal.

[HPF Bob]

The temptation in getting DeSean Jackson is that he's a home run threat everytime he's on the field and how are opponents going to cover him while also covering Andre Johnson and Owen Daniels and Arian Foster? How do you keep that under wraps?

Is it worth sending Mario away? That's up to the front office to decide.