Official Texans @ Cowboys Game Thread, 10/5/2014

[chuck]

This team has very little talent and no depth at all. Bad drafting has almost everything to do with that.

Anyone who's invested in this team winning is mentally ill.

[barrett]

I understand the bad drafting (especially on middle round picks) leaves us hurting, but when you start over with a new staff you turn over the roster anyways. Good drafting those years means we are watching a different coach/qb/team. We are not. This is year 1 and everything going forward is what I can realistically evaluate an O'Brien team on.

Either way the lack of DB depth and OLB talent is not what I finger when we give up 20 points in an OT game and our offense has less that 100 yards of passing offense in the 4th quarter. This team played great on defense today. This team played terrible on offense like we do every week. That is not because of draft issues (unless you count not drafting a QB).

[chuck]

My overall point has always been unless the team miraculously figures out how to have at least average drafts they will always suck. They wasted Andre's career and I suspect we'll watch them waste JJ's.

[HPF Bob]

I can't criticize JJo's coverage on the catch by Dez.

I did feel like if we did not cash in on the first OT possession, we were going to lose because our defense looked spent.

We busted two great runs with Foster and I wondered why we got away from it if they couldn't stop it. 2 downs, 2 yards. I wanted them to go for it on fourth down either way and if it failed, it only shortened the death march in the other direction.

As for the draft, let's see what Clowney has after he comes back in two weeks. I heard Su's-Filo did play in the second half but I didn't see how much. Fedorowicz made rookie mistakes but also made some good blocks on the edge.

[chuck]

Su'a-Filo played one series.

[Arky]

Early lines are coming in on the Thursday Night game. Looks like the Colts are being favored by 2.5 to 3.

---------------------------------------------

Foster was brilliant today. Hope he's got something left for the Colts....

[barrett]

Originally Posted by chuck

My overall point has always been unless the team miraculously figures out how to have at least average drafts they will always suck. They wasted Andre's career and I suspect we'll watch them waste JJ's.

And I think wasting AJ's career had little to do with the draft and some perceived team wide lack of talent. I think the wasting of JJ's career has little to do with the same.

We have played 5 games and not one of those teams was more talented than us outside of the QB position. Today we lost in OT on the road when their QB was 10Xs better than us. That is not the sign of some talent deficient team.

We are losing because we have no QB. It is a drafting issue because we ignored it in the draft, but we have plenty of secondary depth and OLB production to win if we had a league average QB. We have plenty of everything to win a lot if we had a top 10 QB (Andy Dalton/Tony Romo range). We have enough talent to win a superbowl if we had a truly elite top 3 QB. This roster is no worse than the Ravens team that won 2 years ago or either Giants team, or the Packers team. Flawed teams win the superbowl almost every year. We are a flawed team, but we are good enough to win if we properly address the QB problem (hardest thing to do in football and trying to address it is no guarantee we will).

[nunusguy]

Originally Posted by chuck

Su'a-Filo played one series.

C'mon now, we are gonna write-off the entire Draft already ? Sure, I'm with you in being very disappointed about it to this point, but we just played the first game of the second quarter of O'Biren's rookie season, that's all, his career here in Houston is most likely in its embryonic stage - it takes time in this league to develop a winner and a winning record thru winning Drafts. And it takes time to effectively analyze a Draft, can't do it in one month, and certainly not the first month.

[chuck]

Su'a-Filo's kicking Bennie Joppru's ass, that's for sure.

[HPF Bob]

I disagree that the only thing missing is a great QB. I don't think the OL is very good. The TEs are ordinary at best. We let ordinary backs (not Murray, I'm thinking of previous weeks) gash big gains against us and the DBs, while much improved, still scare me except JJo. I don't think we were nearly as bad as the 2-14 record we had last year but I don't think we're as good as the 3-2 record we have now. This is not playoff caliber and I don't care what quarterback you drop into the huddle, it's still not a playoff team. By next year, maybe. But not now.

[Keith]

Tough loss, but the Cowboys won with 3 unique plays where if any of them don't go in their favor, maybe they don't win.

1. The heaving hail mary from Romo as J.J. Watt misses what seems to be an automatic sack.

2. The OPI that wasn't called on the TD to Dez.

3. The heaving hail mary to Dez in OT where Joseph had wonderful coverage... the ball just fell onto Dez to set up the game-winning field goal.

Bottom line is that this is a road loss for the Texans to an NFC opponent. The Texans are 3-0 vs. AFC opponents. Their biggest game of the season is Thursday at home against the Colts. Win that, and this can be an interesting season.

Lastly, congrats to the fans who met Ebola risks head on and made the trip to Arlington. I cannot remember a NFL game where visiting fans had such a presence... maybe Cowboys fans at Arizona games during their Lombardi runs in the 90s. These are fans though of a 2-14 team a year ago, not some Emmitt and Troy bandwagonning jock chompers who already live in a state where NFL hadn't existed the decade previous.

[Nconroe]

Foster really had a good game today.

And seems some blame play calling of going away from Arian for atleast one reason we had the loss in overtime.

And defense won the turnover battle so that helped make it an exciting game. Two turnovers by defense and one turnover by special teams.

Hopefully the dumb penalties which gave us long yardage on 3rd down can be cleaned up as new coaches learn players and players learn the new playbook.

[barrett]

Originally Posted by HPF Bob

I disagree that the only thing missing is a great QB. I don't think the OL is very good. The TEs are ordinary at best. We let ordinary backs (not Murray, I'm thinking of previous weeks) gash big gains against us and the DBs, while much improved, still scare me except JJo. I don't think we were nearly as bad as the 2-14 record we had last year but I don't think we're as good as the 3-2 record we have now. This is not playoff caliber and I don't care what quarterback you drop into the huddle, it's still not a playoff team. By next year, maybe. But not now.

I don't get the OL griping (and I can't believe you and Chuck agree on something).

In the 3 games with a healthy Arian Foster we are rushing for over 150 yards per game while allowing ZERO sacks. All with Fitzpatrick at QB. This is a good OL.

As for the run defense, I agree it's soft, but I'm not particularly worried about it. I can remember 2 games in the last 2 years where I'd call the run defense a major factor in a loss (and we've lost 16 games in that time). Oddly, both of those games featured Rashad Jennings running wild on us. But even if you think it's been a problem more often, it doesn't change the fact we are allowing the 4th fewest points per game in the NFL. That is good enough to be a playoff team if we had league average QB production.

Our OL has blocked and protected, we have good skill position guys, our defense has played great. There are 10 positions we can/need to upgrade. Guess what, the Broncos have a bunch of spots they need to upgrade, and so do the other 11 eventual playoff teams this year. Flawed teams win superbowls, and seriously flawed teams make the playoffs every year.

The Colts have a terrible Roster, draft worse than us (Bjeorn Werner?), wasted money in FA, traded a first round pick for a 3 ypc RB, and will be a threat every year because they have a QB.

This Texans team has one huge problem that hamstrings us and we didn't even try to address it.

[HPF Bob]

The lack of sacks is actually a credit to Fitzpatrick. How often have we seen him get the throw off a half second before getting flattened or had to run for his life to pick up yardage or throw the ball away?

The Texans aren't like the Broncos where their QB's jersey is clean and neatly pressed after 60 minutes. Fitz is taking hits. But part of that is a difference in release (all on the QB) and a lack of open receivers (all on the receivers) so the line isn't totally to blame but it's not like the lack of sacks is because our OL has been some impenetrable wall.

BTW, nice hold by Brandon Brooks to erase that key run late in the game. Nice "man downfield" penalty on Brown during that bubble screen.

[Joshua]

Originally Posted by HPF Bob

The lack of sacks is actually a credit to Fitzpatrick. How often have we seen him get the throw off a half second before getting flattened or had to run for his life to pick up yardage or throw the ball away?

The Texans aren't like the Broncos where their QB's jersey is clean and neatly pressed after 60 minutes. Fitz is taking hits. But part of that is a difference in release (all on the QB) and a lack of open receivers (all on the receivers) so the line isn't totally to blame but it's not like the lack of sacks is because our OL has been some impenetrable wall.

BTW, nice hold by Brandon Brooks to erase that key run late in the game. Nice "man downfield" penalty on Brown during that bubble screen.

Come on, you can't give Fitzpatrick credit for avoiding sacks then turn around and downplay Peyton freakin' Manning's ability to do the same. Peyton is probably the best to ever play the game at getting rid of the ball. He's made countless pedestrian linemen look like hall of famers.

Agree with Barrett. It all depends on the QB. Get a good-to-great one and this team is good enough. Keep trotting out mediocre ones and you can fill in gaps till the cows come home but you'll likely never be more than first round fodder. Take last year, the 4 AFC teams playing on wildcard weekend were Indy, KC, Chargers and Bengals. Setting aside the QB position, which of these teams would you trade rosters with? I'm not sure I would trade with any of them.

[barrett]

Originally Posted by HPF Bob

The lack of sacks is actually a credit to Fitzpatrick. How often have we seen him get the throw off a half second before getting flattened or had to run for his life to pick up yardage or throw the ball away?

The Texans aren't like the Broncos where their QB's jersey is clean and neatly pressed after 60 minutes. Fitz is taking hits. But part of that is a difference in release (all on the QB) and a lack of open receivers (all on the receivers) so the line isn't totally to blame but it's not like the lack of sacks is because our OL has been some impenetrable wall.

BTW, nice hold by Brandon Brooks to erase that key run late in the game. Nice "man downfield" penalty on Brown during that bubble screen.

You're right Bob. Why would I let facts get in the way of a gut feeling.

Even if you count the games without Foster we are 4th in the NFL for fewest sacks allowed and the 3 teams ahead of us have all played 1 less game. And we still run for 127 ypg even with those games. There is no way a team can be above average in every imaginable OL category and have a bad OL.

And if you want to insist that it's Fitzpatrick's greatness, the guy is being sacked half as often on this team as he has been in his career.

[Nconroe]

I'd agree if we had Luck or Rodgers or perhaps Wilson at QB this team would be good enough for playoffs and perhaps with a few lucky bounces to Super Bowl.

But I don't see any of top 4 QB drafted this past draft as being that good. But maybe, who knows 2 or 3 years from now.

And I like how scrappy Fitzpatrick is, he and team needs a lot more consistency if we are going to win games this year.

The salary cap is one reason lost many good drafted players the past 5 years,hoping that is under control for building the next several years.

[Arky]

Originally Posted by HPF Bob

The lack of sacks is actually a credit to Fitzpatrick. How often have we seen him get the throw off a half second before getting flattened or had to run for his life to pick up yardage or throw the ball away?

The Texans aren't like the Broncos where their QB's jersey is clean and neatly pressed after 60 minutes. Fitz is taking hits. But part of that is a difference in release (all on the QB) and a lack of open receivers (all on the receivers) so the line isn't totally to blame but it's not like the lack of sacks is because our OL has been some impenetrable wall.

BTW, nice hold by Brandon Brooks to erase that key run late in the game. Nice "man downfield" penalty on Brown during that bubble screen.

If it makes you feel any better, Teddy Johnson of 610 radio agrees with you. The Texans had 5 penalties yesterday, all on the offense. The defense had a big goose egg.

So, what was the bone of contention again? The Texan OL: not very good or good?

IMHO, the OL is not the #1 problem with the offense but the whole group can be very dysfunctional at times...

[Warren]

Originally Posted by Keith

Lastly, congrats to the fans who met Ebola risks head on and made the trip to Arlington. I cannot remember a NFL game where visiting fans had such a presence... maybe Cowboys fans at Arizona games during their Lombardi runs in the 90s. These are fans though of a 2-14 team a year ago, not some Emmitt and Troy bandwagonning jock chompers who already live in a state where NFL hadn't existed the decade previous.

Very impressive performance by the Texans fans at NRG Stadium North -- the Cowboys had to use a silent snap count at home.

[WMH]

Originally Posted by Warren

Very impressive performance by the Texans fans at NRG Stadium North -- the Cowboys had to use a silent snap count at home.

I was at the game, and yes, it was very impressive. It was truly a 50/50 crowd, maybe 60/40, but it definitely made an impact.

As for as the actual game, tale of 2 halves for the O, solid effort for the D all the way around. I'm sure they were gassed. I thought the O played pretty decent in the 2nd half. Haven't watched the DVR yet, so TV may have shown otherwise.

If our anemic O can put together even 3 of 4 quarters, we sholuld be competitive in more games than not, even with our schedule.