Is WR Maclin Going to be a Bust? [Split Thread]

[painekiller]

Originally Posted by Keith

I imagine I'm in a minority here, but I see Maclin as a bust.

As for Maclin, is that a gut feel or something you have seen? I understand gut feelings and they cannot be explained. I had a gut feeling Reggie Bush was Desmond Howard, and so far I am right. I had a gut feeling that Slaton was Desmond Howard and so far I am wrong, Slaton has shown a willingness to go inside and fight for inches. Boy was wrong on him.

I have not watched much of Maclin because I have not been thinking WR in the top 2 rounds. But the team could be looking for a returner/WR to replace both Jones and Davis. So anything can happen.

[Keith]

Honestly, I am still in big-time catch-up mode when it comes to reviewing prospects. So I didn't watch a lot of Mizzou games, just highlights, videos, etc.

Maclin has some traits of a first rounder, but mostly those of other first round busts. He's a long strider with some deep speed, but I get some Troy Williamson and Ted Ginn family shivers here. Maclin has some straightline speed and vision, which I think is pretty evident in his returns, but I am having a hard time seeing the short area quickness and good route running, critical for most offenses for a WR1. His hands seem okay though, which would separate him from Williamson, but I worry maybe I'm not seeing the full picture.

So Maclin to me looks like a good WR2 candidate, something I do not want with my first round pick, which makes me think bust for anyone selecting him that high.

[Mike]

He certainly is a home run threat in the spread offense and in the return game. The Ginn comparison is valid IMO. The receivers from the spread do concern me, they often win in a scheme or reakdown to get free and not necessarily in a 1:1 match-up. Might be a stretch here, but is he the same type of electric athlete in college similiar to Reggie Bush?

[nunusguy]

Originally Posted by Mike

He certainly is a home run threat in the spread offense and in the return game. The Ginn comparison is valid IMO. The receivers from the spread do concern me, they often win in a scheme or reakdown to get free and not necessarily in a 1:1 match-up. Might be a stretch here, but is he the same type of electric athlete in college similiar to Reggie Bush?

You're right, Ginn is one of the first comparables that jumps to mind for me when somebody mentions the Mizzou WR. And as a Missouri native who
followed MU football back in the day when I still lived up there, I've watched every game that's been available to me on TV here in Houston and followed
the kids performances and progress. He is really fast on the field and I was surprised he didn't break 4.4 at Indy, I dunno maybe an off day for him ?
But he's an electric-athlete in the sense that Bush was, but on the other hand I see no ambivalence in what position he is vs. those uncertainties about Bush even back in college that became crystal clear once he got to the NFL.
And now with the possible departure of Anderson and the teams overt dissatisfaction with Jacobey along with signing the DE in FA, I think the WR
option in the first round is possibly now in play for the Texans moreso than ever before.

[Keith]

Originally Posted by Mike

He certainly is a home run threat in the spread offense and in the return game. The Ginn comparison is valid IMO. The receivers from the spread do concern me, they often win in a scheme or reakdown to get free and not necessarily in a 1:1 match-up. Might be a stretch here, but is he the same type of electric athlete in college similiar to Reggie Bush?

Er, note to Mike, Roy P and others in the dynasty league... my distaste for Maclin in no way removes him from my board. Ginn in fact is still a valuable asset, especially with his return yardage. /fantasyfootballmisdirection

Tough to compare Maclin and Bush since they lined up at different positions, but I can see similarities in how they run. Maclin did well out of the backfield; Bush is obviously a talented receiver. I have a similarly hard time evaluating/slotting Percy Harvin (/said without declaring where he is on my fantasy draft board either, of course).

[Mike]

Keith,

ohhhhh. gamesmanship well before the draft. One of these years we will link up for a trade. Until then, continue to swap rosters with Pops. I'll have someone fall into my lap once the eventual run on RB's takes place.

[popanot]

Originally Posted by Mike

Keith,

ohhhhh. gamesmanship well before the draft. One of these years we will link up for a trade. Until then, continue to swap rosters with Pops. I'll have someone fall into my lap once the eventual run on RB's takes place.

Wanna make a trade? I'm open to all offers.

[papabear]

Originally Posted by Keith

Tough to compare Maclin and Bush since they lined up at different positions, but I can see similarities in how they run. Maclin did well out of the backfield; Bush is obviously a talented receiver. I have a similarly hard time evaluating/slotting Percy Harvin (/said without declaring where he is on my fantasy draft board either, of course).

Guys like Maclin and Harvin are hard for us civillians to evaluate. Those are the guys who really need to be interviewed so you can grill them on their route tree in their current system and see how high their WR IQ is. A lot of the guys in the spread run a drag route or a go route most of the time...both just designed to let them use their superior physical talent. Just because a guy hasn't been in a complicated passing system doesn't mean he's not capable of handling it.

[Keith]

Originally Posted by Mike

Keith,

ohhhhh. gamesmanship well before the draft. One of these years we will link up for a trade. Until then, continue to swap rosters with Pops. I'll have someone fall into my lap once the eventual run on RB's takes place.

I want to send you an offer. Your roster doesn't have many holes I think my team can fill though. I might send one your way though, see where you're at. I think I've run the gamut with the Piranhas though, unless he gets a wild hair and wants to unload MJD (would it help if I said 'please'?). And for as much as I have traded with popanot, I look at ArlingtonTexan's roster and see quite a few of my former players sitting on his bench.

Originally Posted by papabear

Just because a guy hasn't been in a complicated passing system doesn't mean he's not capable of handling it.

Oh I agree, definitely. My Bust-dar is just going off on Maclin since he has a lot of similarities with recent first round WR busts (or recent 'poor values' if not out-and-out busts, at least).

And I actually like Harvin more than Maclin, btw. I guess that's just how I roll. I wasn't a big fan of the Ted Ginn family the year he came out, either.

[Mike]

I have one hole, but when you have depth the likes of Kyle Orton, who needs Carson Palmer.

I should have taken Matty Ice when I had the chance. Then I would be set. I have been kicking myself over that one.

Beaumont texan seems to like my castoffs like Javon Walker and Deuce McCallister. Maybe I will see if he has any interest in some of my guys who I will eventually cut.

[papabear]

Originally Posted by Keith

Oh I agree, definitely. My Bust-dar is just going off on Maclin

Mine goes off for just about every WR. I actually wanted Rogers a little bit over Dre, but that was only because it was pretty obvious that the Lions were going to pick him and thus not give us the choice. In retrospect,l that probably should have told me that AJ was the right choice. Either way I'm leery of trying to project WR's.

[barrett]

Maclin has rare football speed. Maybe even once in a decade type football speed. I would suspect how he performs in the NFL will be more about where he goes and how he is used than anything else.

He is not going to dominate at WR like AJ or Fitzgerald or any other big WR, because unlike those guys, when you bracket him, he does not have the body to still screen off tight coverage and make catches. If you just line him up at WR he is a deep threat, but that doesn't do you a ton of good without other weapons to free him up. You have to find creative ways to involve him in the passing game, the return game, and as a decoy/weapon in trick plays. And you have to do it all while minimizing the wear and tear he takes.

The Saints have done a terrible job of this with Reggie Bush. You can't make a mis-direction guy option one in an offense. The whole idea of screens/draws/trick plays is that you catch the defense going the wrong way. But it loses it's value when you try it 20+ times a game and the defense can just spy him with a fast LB. But they feel the need to force feed him the ball so much due to his contract and draft positon, so the offense is worse when he's on the field despite his obvious talent. You guys all mention Bush as some kind of cautionary tale, but he'd be great if he hadn't been a top 10 pick.

As for picking these guys, I don't think I'd want a small WR or an all-purpose threat in the top half of the first round because teams picking early generally have greater needs. But if you have the right offensive mind pulling the strings, Maclin could be more dangerous offensively than any player in the draft. Just look at Chicago. They don't do anything other than send Hester on go routes, and they pick up 50 yards a game in PI calls and a long touchdown of some type every other week. And he doesn't even know how to play the position or run a route.

I'd stay clear of Maclin because I don't see how we pass up improving our defense, but if someone uses him right he will be just fine.

[Roy P]

Originally Posted by Keith

Maclin has some traits of a first rounder, but mostly those of other first round busts. He's a long strider with some deep speed, but I get some Troy Williamson and Ted Ginn family shivers here.

Troy Williamson = Darrius Heyward-Bey

Ted Ginn = Mike Thomas

DeSean Jackson = Smaller Jeremy Maclin

[machoneil]

Good stuff. I'm picking Maclin @ #2.

[Keith]

Originally Posted by machoneil

Good stuff. I'm picking Maclin @ #2.

lol... Let me know if you need more advice for your pick at 2.02.

[Roy P]

Originally Posted by barrett

Maclin has rare football speed. Maybe even once in a decade type football speed.

I'd stay clear of Maclin because I don't see how we pass up improving our defense, but if someone uses him right he will be just fine.

Ok, I'm taking Maclin and Crabtree off the board. That hurts, but I'm going to focus on Clay Matthews and Vontae Davis at #15.

[painekiller]

Originally Posted by Roy P

Ok, I'm taking Maclin and Crabtree off the board. That hurts, but I'm going to focus on Clay Matthews and Vontae Davis at #15.

Matthews in the low 20's is the target, IMO, but does he continue to climb?

[Roy P]

Originally Posted by painekiller

Matthews in the low 20's is the target, IMO, but does he continue to climb?

Let's take a look at the tale of the tape

---Clay Matthews------DeMarcus Ware
-------6'3"------------------6'4"
------240lbs----------------251lbs
----4.62 - 40--------------4.56 - 40
----1.49 - 10--------------1.62 - 10
--4.18 - Shuttle----------4.07 - Shuttle
--10' 1" - Jump------------10' 2" - Jump
--35.5" - Vert-------------38.5" - Vert
---6.9 - Cone-------------6.85 - Cone
----23 Reps----------------27 Reps

He very well could continue to climb. Especially with the number of teams who are converting to a 3-4 defense.

[nunusguy]

Originally Posted by barrett

Maclin has rare football speed. Maybe even once in a decade type football speed. I would suspect how he performs in the NFL will be more about where he goes and how he is used than anything else.

I'm a fan of Maclin myself, but I don't think he's that fast, atleast not as fast as you make him out to be ? You make him out to be the Usain Bolt of football. I dunno but wasn't there several WRs at the combine who cranked out faster 40s times than Maclin ? Guy couldn't even break 4.40. Just being the Devils-advocate here, because I really like Maclin.