O K - Training Camp is coming up and could someone give me a rookie review ?

[kRocket]

Based on the OTA's and whatever, what will be the impact or non-impact of the current rookie class? I can't get to the workout facility, so I was hoping that someone following them more closely could give me a run-down. Is Duane Brown going to work at OLT ? The other rookies, who will step up, etc. Keep it real please. Just the facts ma'am.

[EndZoneSeats]

I look for Duane Brown to get a long look at OT, the CB to be in the mix especially with Dunta out, and for Slaton to get a very long look as a third-down running back at least.

In a not-too crazy world Slaton could be the RB starter.

[Joshua]

Per Profootballweekly.com's "The Way We Hear It" section -

Keep an eye on the development of rookie CB Antwaun Molden throughout the summer. Molden, a third-round pick from Eastern Kentucky, is likely to be a backup, with ex-Cowboys CB Jacques Reeves settling in as the starter opposite of second-year pro Fred Bennett. However, we're hearing it will not be a surprise if Molden eventually pushes Reeves, and perhaps sooner than later. Molden has played well in his early workouts with the club, and Bennett's ascension to the starting lineup — and impressive development as a rookie — is a reflection of the Texans' ability to develop young cornerbacks. Reeves started 13 games for Dallas last season but was picked on at times.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/NFL/AFC/AFC+South/Houston/WWHI/default.htm

[coloradodude]

Reeves started 13 games for Dallas last season but was picked on at times.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/NFL/AFC/AFC+South/Houston/WWHI/default.htm



You start getting the reputation for getting picked...

[cadams]

i like the sound of that. i had kind of figured moulden would have a shot at being at least the nickle back by the middle of the season.

[KJ3]

i have to believe no news is good news for LT duane brown. right now anyway. if he starts all 16 games his impact is fair.

molden's physical frame and workout numbers are impressive at CB, but being from a small school is going to take him probably a tad longer to get used to the nfl. if he starts not due to injury i'd say his impact is fair too.

slaton is probably the 3rd down back if he can block. starter if our RB situation goes completely to hell. little impact expected.

adibi finds himself in a part of a drastic turnaround of LB depth and quality. of course demeco and greenwood (one more year of THAT contract) get theirs but who between diles, adibi, bentley, thompson or the recently signed rosevelt colvin gets a spot? more importantly, does anyone get cut? if he's a demon on special teams he'll have earned his keep like diles did last year. little impact expected this year.

big frank okam can make it happen if he wants it to happen. here's to hoping he does! if he can be the "force in the middle" against the run i'd say his impact is huge. the difference in games even.

barber is in a numbers game at safety. probably a practice squader. no impact.

alex brink is a shot in the dark that he turns into tom brady or at least someone who we can get some early round picks for. both possible impacts just listed.

[Bigtinylittle]

Granted Smith and Kubiak were a bit under the gun because of the Dunte situation when they signed Reeves, but until it is proved otherwise, I am going to believe they have the ability to judge whether Reeves can play football. From what i understand, Reeves is going to play a different style of defense with us than he did with the Boys. He is going to play press coverage much more, something he apparently excells at. So I will be surprised if, barring injury, Reeves gets beat out by a third round rookie.

Slaton, again barring injury, I expect to see only in spot duty, mainly third down, but possibly on other downs just to give a different look.

Adibi's strength is, from what I have heard, more in the passing game than the running game. Given that our starting OLB's are the opposite of that, I wouldn't be surprised to see him contributing some on passing downs.

Brown supposedly excelled more on run blocking than pass blocking in college, so I wouldn't be surprised to see him in there in some running situations. Barring injury, I see him as a reserve this year, though I could see it going either way.

Okam is a wild card. If he comes into camp in shape and works very hard, I can see him getting the most playing time of any rookie. He has the size and quickness to be a run stopper, something our DT's were below average at last year. In a sense, he is the only rookie who has a clear path to being a starter. It just comes down to whether he is willing to work hard at mastering the art of being an immovable object.

I won't be surprised if a couple of rookies, either draftees or UDFA's, end up on IR like Harrison did last year.

[edo783]

I won't be surprised if a couple of rookies, either draftees or UDFA's, end up on IR like Harrison did last year.

Your not suggesting that we hide rookies on the IR........Oh my.:p

[kRocket]

Thanks guys. I am getting the impression that even if we don't have many immediate impact players that the draft was solid and should fill some needs. It should be interesting this year watching them develop. Personally the guy I would like to see contribute most is Frank Okam. I think he could fill a run-stopper need that was lacking last year. I think Okoye will have a good year if not spectacular and with Mario shaping up to come breathing fire we could have the beginnings of a superior D Line. Let us hope! Thanks for the input.

[KJ3]

Brown supposedly excelled more on run blocking than pass blocking in college, so I wouldn't be surprised to see him in there in some running situations. Barring injury, I see him as a reserve this year, though I could see it going either way.
.

.....so....they are going to switch him and ephraim out to indicate to the defenses whether it's a run or pass?

dude, you know he is currently the starter, right? they gave him the job already, it's his to lose.

[Bigtinylittle]

It makes all the sense in the world right now to put Brown with the first team so he can get the reps and so he can go against Mario. But don't be fooled by that. Kubes is in no way saying that Brown is right now better than Salaam. Salaam doesn't need reps with the first team at this point. Brown does. If the first regular season game was today, I'd be willing to bet good money that Salaam would get the start.

As far a tipping off the other team when you change personnel, teams have used different personnel for different situations for as long as I can remember. Why do you think Brunner is on our team. When he comes in, isn't that tipping the defense? Just because it is a running situation doesn't mean it will be a run. If it is third and fifteen and the coaches think Salaam is a better pass blocker than Brown, they aren't going to risk Schaubs career just because Brown is a first round pick. In that sitiation, if Brown is on the field it will be for only one reason-because he earned it.
But on the other hand, if it is a running SITUATION, DL's aren't going to just pin back their ears and go all out on a pass rush. That doesn't mean the play won't be a pass, just that it isn't an OBVIOUS passing situation. Brown should find it easier to handle that kind of situation.
What I am saying is that if Brown beats out Salaam, it will mean that Kubes thinks he is ready to handle NFL speed rushers. That's something that very few rookie LT's are able to do from day one. Some teams even start guys out on the right side knowing that they eventually want to move them to the left when they are ready.
I personally hope Brown beats out Salaam in training camp. It will mean Kubes/Smith made a pretty solid first round pick.

[kravix]

I dont know if I have ever heard of a team rotating OL. I have posted about it before, but really it boils down to chemistry. The OL needs stay constant. It is easier for them to react to a def when they know the tendencies of the guy next to them. If you have to think about what the guy next to you is going to do it may be to late by the time you react.

I do agree that Brown is not penciled in as the starter. He got reps at OTA's and will likely get alot of the reps in TC and pre season. That still doesnt mean he starts against Pitt. Salaam doesnt need as many reps and this is actually better for him if it turns out brown needs to ride the pine because he will be fresher and less beat up. Down the stretch last year Salaam could barely walk off the field after games.

[painekiller]

I dont know if I have ever heard of a team rotating OL.

The old Cowboys used to rotate either the RG or LG, and they shuttled the play call into the QB. It was the start of the HC or OC calling the plays for the QB.

BTW Stabler, Bradshaw and Pastorini where the last QBS to call their own plays.

[Arky]

I do agree that Brown is not penciled in as the starter. He got reps at OTA's and will likely get alot of the reps in TC and pre season. That still doesnt mean he starts against Pitt.

Right, the way I understand it, the coaching staff is "fast-tracking" Brown right now.... Throwing everything at him in order to see if he can handle this level by season's start. Even if he does start, I expect him to struggle at times - possibly even with Salaam coming in as the "relief pitcher"..... Ugoh, D'brickashaw, etc. all had struggles as rookies...

[edo783]

It would be much more strange if Brown didn't struggle than if he did as a rookie. He will be the starting OLT, the only question is how soon. I see it as 50/50 for Pit., but more like 80/20 before game 7 and near 100% certain before game 10. If he isn't starting by game 10, then I suspect we have a problem of some sort either talent or injury.

[KJ3]

It makes all the sense in the world right now to put Brown with the first team so he can get the reps and so he can go against Mario. But don't be fooled by that. Kubes is in no way saying that Brown is right now better than Salaam. Salaam doesn't need reps with the first team at this point. Brown does. If the first regular season game was today, I'd be willing to bet good money that Salaam would get the start.
kubiak isn't saying brown is better than salaam, i agree, but he made it pretty clear that it's brown's job to lose by handing him the job at the very first opportunity kubiak had. i don't believe kubiak is the kind of coach that would dangle an opportunity like that to a player (a young, 1st round LT rookie with a ton of potential no less) if he didn't believe that player could handle it.

if the first regular season game was today...oh gee, the veteran over the guy who hasn't even been to a singular training camp? sure. excellent point.

As far a tipping off the other team when you change personnel, teams have used different personnel for different situations for as long as I can remember. Why do you think Brunner is on our team. When he comes in, isn't that tipping the defense?
basically everything i've seen is rotations at almost every spot save qb, o'line and #1 reciever. honestly it seems a little stupid to break continuity on the line for as little reason as "we are running this play". bruener is a TE, and yes, a blocking one moreso than a catching one. yet him coming in wouldn't be as ridiculous as sending in your "running o'line" or your "passing o'line". you wouldn't send in your run-blocking o'line for passing plays or vice versa. breuner can maul on either so he's not a dead give away. besides, if the goal is to get brown to be a better all-around LT wouldn't the reps of a game be exactly what he needs? i'm not trying to suggest winston-justice-ing him or anything but gametime reps are the most valuable reps that there are.

What I am saying is that if Brown beats out Salaam, it will mean that Kubes thinks he is ready to handle NFL speed rushers.
there are a lot of better reasons for brown beating out salaam and some don't even have anything to do with football. he's younger, stronger, faster, more agile, better suited to the system because of all those things, he makes more money, he's a 1st round pick, he was chosen by our ground-level-god....

and since we are talking about him so extensively anyway....

i heard brown's strength (besides athleticism) was pass-blocking and his run-blocking was a little suspect. is that right or do i have it backwards?

[Bigtinylittle]

I get the feeling you are arguing with something I never said.
Of all the LT candidates drafted in the first round last year, and there were either six or eight, I can't remember, Brown was almost universally considered the rawest. That's why he went last. He was drafted on potential, not college results. I'm sure that his technique on the first day of OTA's was just as weak as it was in college. OTA's were closed to the public, so message board posters really don't know how much he has improved so far.

When he gets to full contact with pads and practices are open to the public, I'm sure there will be posts discussing his progress or lack thereof. Arguing that he's the starter now is just arguing semantics.
If you look at my original post, I said I could see it going either way. If you think he has it locked up from the get-go, I think you are way off base.

By the way, if you think his pass blocking was his strength, go back and check to see how many sacks he gave up last year. He has a ton of potential but he's raw, raw, raw.

[NBT]

Didn't Duane Brown only play one year at OLT? Wasn't he a TE prior to that? Correct me if I am wrong.

[cadams]

i believe the chronology is that he was recruited as a tight end, was moved to RT in his sophomore year, stayed there his junior year, and then moved to LT his senior year.

[kravix]

i believe the chronology is that he was recruited as a tight end, was moved to RT in his sophomore year, stayed there his junior year, and then moved to LT his senior year.

This is how I see it also. During his Junior year at RT he shut down MW also.

[KJ3]

I get the feeling you are arguing with something I never said.
uh...let's see, you think that salaam is starting and brown is a reserve? and when it's a running play they'll throw brown out there? you typed it man.

When he gets to full contact with pads and practices are open to the public, I'm sure there will be posts discussing his progress or lack thereof. Arguing that he's the starter now is just arguing semantics.
then why has there been such a big deal made of him taking 1st team reps? how is that semantics? starter means starter.

If you look at my original post, I said I could see it going either way. If you think he has it locked up from the get-go, I think you are way off base.
i don't think he had it locked up. i think he was given the job and it's his to lose, so if he isn't showing that he's going to keep it then salaam steps back in.

[Mike]

.....so....they are going to switch him and ephraim out to indicate to the defenses whether it's a run or pass?

That is a Dom Capers move - He did that with Seth Wand a few years ago against be Bears. We were such a JV team/organization back then.

dude, you know he is currently the starter, right? they gave him the job already, it's his to lose.

KJ, I agree with this. However as you point out in another post, if he is not ready and cannot handle the job, Salaam will be the starter. They will give him help with the backs and TE's chipping until he can handle it. Heck, Kubes trusted Charles Spencer so I have do doubt, if he feels Brown can handle it, then he will be the LT.

[Bigtinylittle]

KJ: I agree 100% that it is his to lose. I think Kubiak has made that clear. And I think they didn't draft him unless they thought they could fast-track him. I just don't think it is a given that he is going to be better than Salaam on opening day. And if Salaam is better, he will start. It's a big jump from college to the pros. Like I said in my original post, I think it could go either way. If you don't think so, then I guess we will have to agree to disagree.

By the way. I never meant to imply that I thought they would be rotating in and out every play. If that was the impression I gave everyone, then my bad.

[barrett]

I have heard great things about Barber and his play near the line of scrimmage. Anyone else hear anything?

[KJ3]

I have heard great things about Barber and his play near the line of scrimmage. Anyone else hear anything?

i've heard he's doing well but no specifics really. i think he'll be lucky (and probably a pretty good safety) if he makes the team behind demps-the obvious starter, brown and earl-the two fighting for a spot and the brandons who have many things going their way.

nice as the extra pickup in the 6th but i think there really must have been a scourge across the late-round-DE-land because we really should have spent the pick getting some help across from mario. 6th rounders rarely make significant differences so i'm not that worried.

[edo783]

My guess is that he probably wont do well enough this year to unseat one of the guys and will be put on the PS for next year. Then I think he might win a backup and perhaps a starters role.

[Bigtinylittle]

Quote from the horse's mouth:

"Yeah, [Brown will] work with the first group. We have a long way to go before we play Pittsburgh and who's out there opening day. But he'll continue to work with that group and (T) Ephraim Salaam and (T) Rashad Butler will push the heck out of those two tackles that we have. So, we'll see what happens."