View Full Version : Official Texans vs. Rams Game Thread, 10/13/2013
The 2-3 Texans will host the 2-3 St. Louis Rams Sunday at Reliant. The Texans are coming off a 34-3 shellacking at the hands of the San Francisco 49'ers while the Rams defeated the Jacksonville Jaguars 34-20.
TV = FOX, Noon CST, Sunday
Announcers (http://506sports.com/nfl.php?yr=2013&wk=6) = Chris Myers, Tim Ryan
The line (http://www.madduxsports.com/nfl-odds.php) = Texans by 7 to 9
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In the the quest for 5 Pick Sixes in a row department: Per 610 radio, an announcement that Kubiak is going to go with Matt Schaub as the QB against the Rams.
popanot
10-09-2013, 03:14 PM
I can't predict the winner but I can confidently predict a pick-6. :o
HPF Bob
10-09-2013, 05:05 PM
Maybe we should start a pool for who will take back the Pick 6.
Here's the Rams' depth chart:
http://http://www.stlouisrams.com/team/depth-chart.html
It won't be Courtland Finnegan because Angry Dre would just beat him up. Therefore, I'm going with Alec Ogletree.
I'm going with CB Janoris Jenkins for the first Pick 6. Since OD is out, I see Schaubie leaning on AJ for extra targeting..... The CB's will be waiting...:(
popanot
10-10-2013, 07:41 AM
I'm going with Michael Brockers.
Kubiak wins the coin toss and elects to receive (like he always does, and like most good coaches don't)... Kubiak's thinking is "Let's get Matty out there quick to start this off and get those cobwebs worked out" (that's opposed to the logical thinking of having the D open things up and letting an already frustrated and ticked-off crowd settle in, or better yet, the D making a big play and getting the crowd fired up)...
On the ensuing kickoff, the Texans are pinned down inside the 15 because Marciano's crew can't block and no one bothered to tell KMart not to carry the ball out from 8-yards deep in the endzone...
The Offense comes onto the field amidst a chorus of boos (let's get this started right, Gary)...
First down, Foster for no gain... Second down, Schaub drops back and feels the pressure (when there really is none)... He then throws an off-balance back-leg pass that bounces off Duane Brown's helmet and into the loving arms of Michael Brockers who then scampers untouched into the endzone... 0-7...
The crowd is stunned with silence where only a baby's cry can be heard in the distance...
Nconroe
10-10-2013, 09:17 AM
Now that's funny.
popanot
10-10-2013, 10:21 AM
I'm going with CB Janoris Jenkins for the first Pick 6LOL! You're expecting more than one, Arky? :)
Nothing would surprise me at this point. Actually, Schaub came very close to having 3 Pick-6's against SF. The potential second one was on an INT along the sideline in our zone (go figure, Schaub throws a noodle-arm sideline pass) that Dre fortunately stopped by pushing the guy out of bounds. He had a clear path to a TD had Dre been a step slower. The third one was a darn-near gimme INT the SF Safety dropped, where if he had caught it, he had a decent shot at taking it in for a TD.
Lance reviews the pick-6 and the dropped INT here (not sure why he didn't review the INT and possible pick-6 Dre saved).
http://www.thesidelineview.com/columns/nfl/matt-schaub-down-count
LOL! You're expecting more than one, Arky? :)
Yeah, I wondered if anyone would catch that..... :p
Actually, I hope the fans are somewhat civil. A little booing is expected - just hope (for Schaub's sake, after all he's a human) that the crowd doesn't set any Guinness records for dB/volume.
Let Schaub decide which way it goes..... Play decently and make not too many mistakes and finish the game with a W and things may turn out OK.
I'm thinking there's short leashes all around. The crowd will have the shortest leash. You gotta think his teammates are going to have a short leash. If he starts stinking it up again, he's going to take his teammates right outta the game. Kubes better bench him before that happens.....
cadams
10-10-2013, 01:15 PM
schaub throws a 4 yard out on 3rd and 9, and long jumps the route and returns it for a touchdown.
no need to only let the defensive backs have all the fun
cadams
10-10-2013, 01:17 PM
Yeah, I wondered if anyone would catch that..... :p
Actually, I hope the fans are somewhat civil. A little booing is expected - just hope (for Schaub's sake, after all he's a human) that the crowd doesn't set any Guinness records for dB/volume.
Let Schaub decide which way it goes..... Play decently and make not too many mistakes and finish the game with a W and things may turn out OK.
I'm thinking there's short leashes all around. The crowd will have the shortest leash. You gotta think his teammates are going to have a short leash. If he starts stinking it up again, he's going to take his teammates right outta the game. Kubes better bench him before that happens.....
honestly, i kubiak has any sense at all he should defer if the texans win the toss this week. give the crowd time to get in the game (if the defense can come up with something), and that will likely cut a lot of the boos out.
with that said, i do not suspect this will happen.
nunusguy
10-10-2013, 01:45 PM
I'm actually fairly confidant the Texans win this weekend which is unusual because I tend to be pretty pessimistic in these situations. The real drama should be the following game in KC leading us into the bye week.
Nconroe
10-10-2013, 07:28 PM
Interesting article strategy if win the toss
http://mobile.nytimes.com/blogs/fifthdown/2011/12/02/the-strategy-and-consequences-of-the-n-f-l-coin-toss/
popanot
10-13-2013, 10:19 AM
IMO, Schaub has nothing to gain but everything to lose today. I don't think this game will tell us anything about Schaub even if he does well. The KC and Indy games will be the real indicators. That is, if he does play well today. If he doesn't we'll see TJ for the KC game.
As for Schaub's play, I hope he does well and can rebound. I do believe he gives this team the best chance at turning it around and making a playoff run. I don't think TJ or Keenum is the answer (and certainly not the answer long-term). However, I'm not sure Schaub can rebound. I think his funk has more to do with his arm than it does his confidence or decision making, although, those are questionable right now too. Other than mid-range passes over the middle of the field, his passes no longer have any zip on them. Who dosen't cringe now every time he throws a sideline pass?
Ram to receive the kickoff. Returner brings the kickoff back to the Ram 33.
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Stacy for loss of 1. 2nd and 11 coming up.
Stacy for 3. 3rd and 8 coming up.
Flags presnap.....Offsides JJ Watt. 3rd and 3 coming up.
Bradford pressured, throws inc. Rams have to punt.
Keo fair catches at the Texan 13. Texans ball.
Foster for 18. Ball at the Texan 31.
Foster for maybe 2. 2nd and 8 coming up.
Foster up the gut for about 10 and a first down. Ball at the Texan 44.
Foster caught for loss of 2. 2nd and 12 coming up.
Schaub pressured throws it into the ground, inc. Brings up 3rd and 12.
Pass to Foster complete for about 10 but flag on D Brown for facemask.. Makes it 3rd and 27 coming up.
Foster goes around left end for 4. Texans to punt.
Punt is downed by Posey at the Ram 34. Rams ball.
Bradford's pass in the flat sails inc. 2nd and 10 coming up.
Deep pass is overthrown but 2 flags on the Texans. Roughing the passer on A Smith is declined. PI on KJ is accepted. Places the ball at the Texan 25.
Stacy for no gain. 2nd and 10 coming up.
Screen to Givens goes to the Texan 12, first down.
Stacy for 6. 2nd and 4 coming up.
Stacy rushes for 5 and a 1st down at the Texan 2. 1st and goal.
Bradford's short pass to Harkey is good for the TD.
Rams 7, Texans 0
5:59 left in the 1st quarter.
chuck
10-13-2013, 12:21 PM
This is a foolish question but did the Rams win the toss?
nunusguy
10-13-2013, 12:23 PM
Not flagrant interference by Kareem, but nevertheless it's the play of the drive that goes against the Texans. Now Schaub is gonna have to do something more than hand the ball off.
Manning bobbles the ensuing kickoff but gets it out to the 12. Texans ball.
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Schaub can't find a receiver and is caught for loss of 1. 2nd and 11 coming up.
Pass to Hopkins over the middle good for 22.
Pass to Jones goes for 4. 2nd and 6 coming up.
Foster sweeps right for about 5 but flags are down......Holding on Newton makes it 2nd and 14.
Short pass to Tate goes for about 9 but flags down.... Piling on on the Rams gives and auto 1st down at the Ram 46.
Tate for maybe 1.
Pass to AJ goes for 18 and a 1st down.
Pass to Hopkins goes for big gainer but Hopkins fumbles and Laurinaitis picks it up and returns it all the way to the Texan 43. Rams ball.
Stacy gets 7. 2nd and 3 coming up.
Pass to Austin goes for 3 and a 1st down.
Stacy for about 2. 2nd and 8 coming up. Ball at the Texan 31.
End of the 1st quarter.
This is a foolish question but did the Rams win the toss?
Don't know. They never said. My guess is they (Rams) won it cause Kubes just about never defers....
Pass to Givens goes for 7. Brings up 3rd and 1.
Flags presnap..... False start Rams makes it 3rd and 6.
Dump off pass to Stacy goes for 5. Rams to go for the FG.
Zuerlein's 42-yard FG is good.
Rams 10, Texans 0
13:22 left in the half.
The ensuing kickoff goes out of the endzone, touchback. Texans ball at their 20.
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Foster sweeps left for about 12.
Pass to Hopkins goes for 13.
Foster for 23.
Foster all the way to the 10 yard line. 22 yards.
Foster for 5. 2nd and goal from the 5.
Tate for 1. 3rd and goal from the 4.
Flags presnap.... offsides Newton.... Makes it 3rd and goal from the 9.
Pass to Martin goes to the 2. Texans to go for the FG.
Bullock's 20-yarder is good.
Rams 10, Texans 3
8:21 left in the half.
Matt Van Gundy?
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The ensuing kickoff is downed in the endzone, touchback. Rams ball at their 20.
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Deep pass to Givens just off his fingertips, inc.
Richardson for no gain. 3rd and 10 coming up.
Screen to Richardson goes for 18 and a first down.
Richardson for 4.
Flags presnap.....Encroachment on Texans makes it 2nd and 1.
Stacy for about 6 and the 1st down. Ball at the Texan 45.
Bradford scrambles for about 5 but late hit from Cushing adds 15 more. Ball is at the Texan 26.
Stacy goes right up the gut for big gainer. Ball at the Texan 8, 1st and goal.
Richardson for about 1.
Stacy for 5. Ball at the 2. 3rd and goal. About 3 minutes left in the half.
Pass to Kendricks goes for the TD.
Rams 17, Texans 3
2:43 left in the half.
The ensuing kickoff goes out of the endzone, touchback. Texans ball at their 20.
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Pass to Hopkins goes inc. 2nd and 10 coming up.
Pass to Martin at the sideline gets 5. 3rd and 5 coming up.
Pass to AJ goes for 15 and the 1st down at the Texan 40.
2 minute warning.
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Dumpoff pass to Foster goes all the way to the Ram 19. 41 yards.
Schaub sacked for loss of 3. 2nd and 13 coming up with 1:37 left in the half. Ball is at the Ram 22.
Pass to Foster good for 5. 3rd and 8 coming up.
Schaub's pass to Hopkins in the endzone is inc. Texans to go for the FG.
Bullock's 35-yarder is good.
Rams 17, Texans 6
49 seconds left in the half.
Rams bring the ensuing kickoff back to their 25. Rams ball.
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Stacy (?) for 4.
Time runs out.
Halftime.
Halftime stats:
Passing: Schaub 11/14, 153 yards, 0 TD, 0 INT
Rushing: Foster 10/98, Tate 2/1
Receiving: Hopkins 3/47, Foster 2/46, AJ 2/34, K Mart 2/12
Tackles: Manning/B Reed 4 each, E Reed/A Smith/Cushing/Mercilus 3 each, Mays/Mitchell 2 each
Time of possession: Texans 14:34, Rams 15:26
1st downs: Texans 11, Rams 10
3rd down efficiency: Texans 1/4, Rams 2/4
Red zone: Texans 0/2, Rams 2/2
Penalties: Texans 7/95, Rams 2/20
Turnovers: Texans 1, Rams 0
Total yards: Texans 248, Rams 115
2nd half kickoff goes out of bounds at the 2. Texans ball at their 40.
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Pass to AJ goes for 11. Ball at the Ram 49.
Schaub pressured, throws inc. 2nd and 10 coming up.
Foster for no gain. 3rd and 10 coming up.
Pass to Graham gets 5. On 4th and 5, Texans to punt.
Lechler's punt goes into the endzone, touchback. Rams ball at their 20.
Dumpoff pass to Stacy gets 5.
Stacy caught in the backfield for loss of 1. 3rd and 6 coming up.
Pass to Cook goes for 11 and the 1st down.
Stacy runs for 14. Ball at the Ram 49.
Pass to Quick goes inc. 2nd and 10 coming up.
Pass to Pettis goes for 11 or 12 and the 1st down.
Stacy caught for loss of 1. 2nd and 11 coming up.
Pass to Cook goes all the way to the Texan 7. 1st and goal.
Stacy for 2. 2nd and goal coming up.
Short pass to Quick goes for the TD.
Rams 24, Texans 6
7:42 left in the 3rd quarter.
Martin fumbles the ensuing kickoff and the Rams (Bates) pick it up and score the TD.
Rams 31, Texans 6
7:36 left in the 3rd quarter.
BigBull
10-13-2013, 01:49 PM
Wtf is wrong with this team?
nunusguy
10-13-2013, 01:51 PM
When it rains, it pours.
Time to clean house ? Maybe, but this year is a mulligan for Kubiak, even if they don't win another game which is starting to look possible.
Martin brings the ensuing kickoff back to the Texan 31.
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Schaub can't find a receiver and throws it away, inc.
Pass to AJ goes for 13 or 14 and a 1st down.
Pass to Foster inc. 2nd and 10 coming up.
Foster goes left side for 8. 3rd and 2 coming up.
Foster for about 7 and the 1st down. Ball at the Ram 40.
Short pass to AJ gets 4.
Foster rushes for about 5. 3rd and 1 coming up.
Foster goes left for about 4 and the 1st down. Under 4 minutes left in the game.
Down goes Schaub. Schaub injured on the play. Injury timeout.
chuck
10-13-2013, 01:59 PM
I told you guys that Schaub would get hurt and that the home crowd would cheer.
What I didn't know is that Marciano would find a way to gift the opposing team a touchdown on a Texans return. That's pretty special.
BigBull
10-13-2013, 02:05 PM
TJ just pulled a Schaub.
Yates in.
On 2nd and 16, Yate's pass to Foster gets 4. 3rd and 12 coming up.
Pass to Foster gets about 7. Texans going for it on 4th and 5.
Timeout Texans.....
Pass to Hopkins inc but flag on the Ram for offsides results in a 1st down. Ball at the Ram 13.
Foster for 4.
Yates pass to Jones off the mark, inc. 3rd and 6 coming up.
Pass to Posey gets about 3. Texans going for it on 4th and 3.
Hehe..... Yates throws the pick 6! 98 yards! SMFH...
Rams 38, Texans 6
Nconroe
10-13-2013, 02:09 PM
Next QB up, Keenum. Actualu might as well let all the third stringers play rest of game, couldn't get much worse.
BigBull
10-13-2013, 02:11 PM
Next QB up, Keenum. Actualu might as well let all the third stringers play rest of game, couldn't get much worse.
He's not active this week.
Martin brings the ensuing kickoff back to the Texan 19.
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Foster for 3 or 4.
End of the 3rd quarter.
Pass to AJ gets the 1st down a the Texan 37.
Foster for no gain.
Pass to Graham goes to the Ram 42. Roughing the passer +15. Places the ball at the Ram 27.
Quick pass to AJ gets 12.
Yates tucks it and runs for no gain. 2nd and 10 coming up.
Yates' pass is INT'ed in the endzone by Jenkins. Jenkins brings it out to the 2. Rams ball.
BigBull
10-13-2013, 02:18 PM
TJ is doing such a good job of imitating Schaub its like he is Schaub.:o
popanot
10-13-2013, 02:19 PM
This team is beyond defeated. I'm amazed at how unprepared and how poorly this team plays for a veteran team. Smith and McNair need to have some balls and clean house now. I don't give a $hit if that means Wade is the HC the rest of the year. Sick of Kubiak and everyone else on his crap staff.
Not saying STs are the main reason for losing this game, but I'm baffled as to why these guys continuously run out KO's 8-yds deep in the endzone. Is there seriously no one telling these buffoons to just down it and take it on the 20? If Marciano isn't fired tomorrow it will prove to me how impotent this organization's management is.
Stacy for 5.
Flags presnap.... illegal snap on Rams makes it 2nd and 9.
Stacy for 2 or 3. 3rd and 7 coming up.
Stacy for 2. Rams have punt on 4th and 4.
Keo fields the punt and returns it a couple of yards to the Rams 48. Texans ball with 9:17 left in the game.
Nconroe
10-13-2013, 02:26 PM
I think I read we are averaging like 24 yds per KR which is like 4 yds better than touch back.
All these penalties and turnovers are amazing .
Foster for 6.
Foster caught for loss of 1.
Screen to Foster is dropped, inc. Texans to go for it on 4th and 5.
Short pass to Jean gets the 1st down plus roughing the QB on the Rams +15. Ball at the Rams 21.
Tate for about 2 but flag down.... Illegal hands on Rams +5 and an auto 1st down. Ball at the Ram 14.
Tate for no gain.
Yates' pass is tipped, inc. flag down.... offsides Rams repeat down. Makes it 2nd and 6 coming up.
Tate for about 5.
Tate for no gain. Brings up 4th and 1 and Texans going for it.
Tate to the 2 yard line and a 1st down. Under 5 minutes left in the game.
Tate for 1. 2nd and goal coming up.
Tate rushes up the middle. Ball is ruled at the 1 yard line. Kubes challenges that the ball broke the plane.....
Play stands as called....
On 3rd and goal, Tate finally punches it in.
Rams 38, Texans 13
3:15 left in the game.
chuck
10-13-2013, 02:34 PM
If Marciano isn't fired tomorrow it will prove to me how impotent this organization's management is.
Seriously? You're still trying to gauge this?
Big Texas
10-13-2013, 02:35 PM
Yes, it's time for this administration to go. Great players on both sides of the ball and we are getting blown out by scrubs...this team has lost its pride and fire.... 400 yds of offense and three turnovers in the red zone. This team has regressed and is in danger of going 2-14 at this rate.
popanot
10-13-2013, 02:35 PM
I think I read we are averaging like 24 yds per KR which is like 4 yds better than touch back.Anyone who looks at that stat and thinks this KO return team is doing a good job and should continue to run out kicks needs to see a doctor ASAP.
Austin downs the ensuing kickoff at the Ram 11 yard line. Rams ball.
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Cunningham rushes for 1.
Flags presnap.... offsides Rams makes it 2nd and 14 coming up.
Cunningham for 3. 3rd and 11 coming up.
Cunningham gets about 7. Rams have to punt.
2 minute warning.
Keo fields the punt and is downed at the Texan 39. Texans ball.
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Screen to Tate gets no gain.
Dumpoff to Tate gets 6.
Pass to Griffin gets the 1st down at the Ram 45.
Pass to Jean gets 8.
Pass to Tate almost INT'ed but inc. 3rd and 2 coming up with 25 seconds left in the game.
Pass to Griffin gets the 1st down.
Yates fumbles, Texans recover and time runs out.
Final score:
Rams 38, Texans 13
BigBull
10-13-2013, 02:50 PM
I'm embarrassed to be a Texans fan after this joke of a performance.:o
nunusguy
10-13-2013, 03:01 PM
Yes, it's time for this administration to go. Great players on both sides of the ball and we are getting blown out by scrubs...this team has lost its pride and fire.... 400 yds of offense and three turnovers in the red zone. This team has regressed and is in danger of going 2-14 at this rate.
"Great players on both sides of the ball'' for the Texans ? And who would they be, you are gonna have to point them out to me, because I didn't see any great players on the home team today.
barrett
10-13-2013, 04:06 PM
On the season we have allowed 1517 yards in 6 games (about 253 ypg). We have gained 2374 (396 ypg). It takes a truly special combination of turnovers, special teams incompetence, and 2-way red zone surrender to outgain your opponents by an AVERAGE of almost 150 ypg and lose twice as much as you win.
I said before today I would be rooting against the Texans and was hoping for 2-14 since that would ensure meaningful change. Even with those hopes today suprised me in just how terrible we were.
One thing that didn't suprise me was Yates. That's just what I would expect from him.
That was not good entertainment.....
Can't believe TJ threw a pick 6. That's just crazy......
Went back on watched the Schaub injury on the DVR. Don't believe that an ankle is supposed to turn in that direction. Too bad. If he's out, we are even more screwed this year than we already were.
I'm seriously starting to doubt all the comments regarding the "talent" we have on this team, as I sure don't see it in quite a few areas.
TheMatrix31
10-13-2013, 09:24 PM
Kubiak needs to be fired and that's that.
HPF Bob
10-13-2013, 10:15 PM
What can you say about that type of game except the season is now officially on life support. If they don't beat KC next week, they will go into the bye week on a five-game losing streak and their season is effectively over.
Gives some props to the Rams. They are starting to put themselves together.
As for Yates, that did look amazingly like nothing had changed with Schaub out. Except the refs will call roughing when Yates get hit. I swear, the refs have some pact where Schaub never gets a roughing flag.
There's just layers upon layers at work here so I'll just hit on a couple of things that are bothering me....
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I'm going to defend Yates. He probably didn't even get any extra reps this week. He's like the old dusty tool in the woodshed that needs tweaking before it is usable again. Of course, I didn't like the pick 6 or the dink & dunk "comeback" he executed. Have we completely given up on the long ball? Hell, I'll take a 25-yard pass - complete or incomplete. Just show it occasionally...
I'd really like to see what Keenum can do unless he's put in a puppetmaster situation. But it's too early to totally write off Yates, IMO.....
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As for Schaub, not a fan of Solomon (http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/2013/10/texans) at the Chron but he summed it up pretty succinctly:
3. Matt Schaub has gotten over his pick-six-aphobia.
That’s the good news (zero interceptions). The bad news is he was back to being the Schaub that so disappointed Texans fans at the end of last year. You know, the one who throws passes into the dirt after escaping the rush and the one who checks down when there is no rush. The best examples of both were at the start of the third quarter, when the Texans trailed 17-6 and needed to get something going. On a first down from the Rams’ 49, Schaub slid away from slight pressure then threw the ball into the dirt trying to hit Andre Johnson on a pass that top college quarterbacks make with regularity these days. On third down, Schaub (15 of 21 for 186 yards) dropped into the pocket and didn’t even allow his receivers to run their routes before he threw underneath to Garrett Graham, who was some five yards short of the first down. It was as if Schaub thought it was third-and-3 instead of third-and-10.
I could care less about being morally outraged at the whole cheering the injury deal.....it's fans being fans. Controversy makes for hot topics and some people are not nice (duh). Big deal, get over it.
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The team is a mess right now and I don't have any answers. But hey, at least we kicked their asses in time of possession and total yards. :rolleyes:
cadams
10-14-2013, 09:25 AM
Went back on watched the Schaub injury on the DVR. Don't believe that an ankle is supposed to turn in that direction. Too bad. If he's out, we are even more screwed this year than we already were.
I'm seriously starting to doubt all the comments regarding the "talent" we have on this team, as I sure don't see it in quite a few areas.
i don't think they are anymore screwed than they would be with him. i agree he is better than tj and case, but the offense had scored no touchdowns in 9 quarters with schaub in. not sure it can get any worse.
cadams
10-14-2013, 10:11 AM
oh, and to answer the question about the coin toss. the rams won it.
The line (http://www.madduxsports.com/nfl-odds.php) for Texans vs. Chiefs opened at Chiefs by 4 and has quickly jumped to Chiefs by 6.5 to 7 (i.e., early money coming in on the Chiefs).
Usually, the books will hold off on posting a line if the status of the starting QB (Schaub) is unknown. I'm guessing they don't think it makes any difference..... :o
Looks like we lost D Manning for 6-8 weeks.
Anybody heard Schaub's status? Out a week? 2 weeks or more?
Anybody heard Schaub's status? Out a week? 2 weeks or more?
Haven't seen anything. My guess, and I'm pulling this straight out of my arse, Schaub sits this week an is back after the bye. That would likely be the best case scenario.
cadams
10-14-2013, 02:10 PM
i am starting to think that the best case scenario is a top 10 pick and taking a qb
popanot
10-14-2013, 02:35 PM
Looks like we lost D Manning for 6-8 weeks.
no worries. we have ed reed. oye
BigBull
10-14-2013, 03:30 PM
no worries. we have ed reed. oye
The thought of that makes me want to throw up. They should have resigned GQ.
Warren
10-14-2013, 05:30 PM
Kubiak says they'll make a determination on Schaub later in the week (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/10/14/gary-kubiak-matt-schaubs-status-will-be-end-of-the-week-decision/).
HPF Bob
10-14-2013, 06:37 PM
Saw this and couldn't resist:
Bob McNair has a bumper sticker that says "My other Carr is a Schaub."
chuck
10-14-2013, 11:49 PM
Saw this and couldn't resist:
Bob McNair has a bumper sticker that says "My other Carr is a Schaub."
All of this is obviously totally on McNair. I'm not wishing for a Daniel Snyder, you know, I think all current and former Astros fans have seen what can happen when in the ownership a team trades one piece of slime for another piece of slime. But some accountability would be nice every once in a while. Some indication that the owner is interested in winning rather than cashing checks would be nice every once in a while.
I'm afraid what it comes down to is that McNair is another POS Texas fraud of an owner in a long and storied line of them. The only possible way to stop this bullshit is for people to quit paying for it. I somehow don't see that happening in my lifetime.
HPF Bob
10-15-2013, 08:17 AM
So what type of owner are you asking for, Chuck? Robert Kraft? Arte Moreno? Mark Cuban? Woody Johnson? Jerry Jones?
My only real knock on McNair is that he's probably too patient but he made changes after the 2-14 disaster in 2005 and maybe he will again after this year's collapse.
I got jumped on earlier when I said I thought perhaps the game had passed by Kubiak and Phillips but maybe now folks understand better what I mean. Kubiak's system no longer surprises anyone and neither does Wade's 3-4 although it hasn't been that awful other than not generating sacks and turnovers.
Signing Ed Reed was a huge mistake And at what point do we start holding Rick Smith accountable?
BigBull
10-15-2013, 08:42 AM
So what type of owner are you asking for, Chuck? Robert Kraft? Arte Moreno? Mark Cuban? Woody Johnson? Jerry Jones?
My only real knock on McNair is that he's probably too patient but he made changes after the 2-14 disaster in 2005 and maybe he will again after this year's collapse.
I got jumped on earlier when I said I thought perhaps the game had passed by Kubiak and Phillips but maybe now folks understand better what I mean. Kubiak's system no longer surprises anyone and neither does Wade's 3-4 although it hasn't been that awful other than not generating sacks and turnovers.
Signing Ed Reed was a huge mistake And at what point do we start holding Rick Smith accountable?
I think you hit the nail on the head about Kubiak's and Wade's systems.
I got jumped on earlier when I said I thought perhaps the game had passed by Kubiak and Phillips but maybe now folks understand better what I mean. Kubiak's system no longer surprises anyone and neither does Wade's 3-4 although it hasn't been that awful other than not generating sacks and turnovers.
What system surprises anyone anymore? I've heard that alot lately, especially since things aren't going as planned, but I'm not sure I'm buying it. Play selection issues, absolutely, but system issues?
The zone read option was the thing last year. How's Kapernick and Wilson doing with that this year? Thier rushing yards are attributed to scrambles, as we saw first hand, and they were damaging.
NFL coaches are smart enough, and spend enough time on it to catch up with everything eventually.
At the end of the day, it comes down to execution, regardless of system. IMO, with the Texans that starts in the trenches, and this is by far our worst Oline play we have seen in the Kubiak era.
Not saying you're wrong, but I just have a hard time throwing my hands up and saying its a system thing, when on just about every goof we have can be lead to poor execution of the play.
Keith
10-15-2013, 10:56 AM
What system surprises anyone anymore? I've heard that alot lately, especially since things aren't going as planned, but I'm not sure I'm buying it.
The difference to me is that the best QBs in the league are able to read a defense before the snap, make changes if need be, and execute on the play.
Kubiak is limiting his QB's ability to free-style in this manner. I can understand why he may do that with a backup like Yates or someone with just 1-2 years in his playbook, but Schaub has been here since 2007. This is his SEVENTH freaking season with Kubiak! If Schaub hasn't earned the right to audible in Kubiak's offense, then the Texans will never catch any by surprise.
Hard to believe it has been seven years with Kubiak and Schaub... that is a long long time.
Joshua
10-15-2013, 11:49 AM
What system surprises anyone anymore? I've heard that alot lately, especially since things aren't going as planned, but I'm not sure I'm buying it. Play selection issues, absolutely, but system issues?
The zone read option was the thing last year. How's Kapernick and Wilson doing with that this year? Thier rushing yards are attributed to scrambles, as we saw first hand, and they were damaging.
NFL coaches are smart enough, and spend enough time on it to catch up with everything eventually.
At the end of the day, it comes down to execution, regardless of system. IMO, with the Texans that starts in the trenches, and this is by far our worst Oline play we have seen in the Kubiak era.
Not saying you're wrong, but I just have a hard time throwing my hands up and saying its a system thing, when on just about every goof we have can be lead to poor execution of the play.
You answered your own question. You acknowledged that the zone read was a surprise used with success last year. The fact that it isn't successful until the end of time doesn't mean that those teams didn't greatly benefit from it last season.
And I don't generally re-watch the games but it seems like teams are having their backside DEs stay home and play the boot and we don't have an answer for that. So, what was one of our most successful plays and one of the staples of our offense is now rarely called and when it is, it's a disaster (see Seattle). That's a huge system issue when one of the things you predicate your offense around disappears and there's nothing to take its place.
chuck
10-15-2013, 01:45 PM
I would take any owner who cares more about winning than anything else and whose mistakes happen because he is trying to win.
I got jumped on earlier when I said I thought perhaps the game had passed by Kubiak and Phillips but maybe now folks understand better what I mean.
I understood what you meant and agreed totally. Otherwise do you really think I would forfeit an opportunity to give you a hard time about something? My Texans-induced apathy does have its limits, you know.
nunusguy
10-15-2013, 01:48 PM
My only real knock on McNair is that he's probably too patient but he made changes after the 2-14 disaster in 2005 and maybe he will again after this year's collapse.
Bob, I'm right there with you on your comments about McNair. I still think he's one of the best owners in the NFL and I'm still very grateful that he brought that sports league back to Houston. And eventually when Kubiak needs to go whenever that is, McNair might be a bit too deliberate getting it done but he'll probably make the right move when it happens.
barrett
10-15-2013, 02:21 PM
I'd rather have McNair than an owner who wanted to be involved. McNair makes a decision that affects the team once or twice a decade (HC/GM hire/fire). That means a guy with no real football background and no professional training makes a decision twice a decade. Compare that to the Cowboys, Jets, Redskins, etc... where an unqualified guy meddles constantly. Where Woody Johnson sinks a whole season to get a piece of the Tebow media coverage. Where Jerry Jones runs the franchise like its John Madden and dumps obscene contracts on skill positions and never has adequate line play because he is an amateur play acting at GM. Or Washington where the owner will do anything to win except be patient so the team is always re-uppin on the fly and looking for short cuts rather than building.
We may not like the professional decision makers in Houston, but it is better than having some guy with a business sense acting out his whims as a fan because his bank account lets him.
chuck
10-15-2013, 04:11 PM
We may not like the professional decision makers in Houston, but it is better than having some guy with a business sense acting out his whims as a fan because his bank account lets him.
I don't view it as an either/or proposition.
barrett
10-15-2013, 05:04 PM
I don't view it as an either/or proposition.
I agree with you that they are not entirely mutually exclusive. But I do think owners who value winning first do not truly exist. These are guys who are all about money. That is how they got where they are. They do not throw away money in the name of ideals. They might be willing to spend short term to secure a superbowl, but every owner in the NFL is self serving and business first. They use public money to build stadiums, and then they charge the public for the right to buy tickets in public funded stadiums (PSLs). Owning an NFL team is basically a right to print money (at taxpayer expense).
Now some owners are content to own a franchise and be a part of the club. Clearly Bob McNair values being a "well respected" member of the owners fraternity more than the W/L record of the Texans. I am fine with that. I don't think Bob Kraft is any different. He just made 1 really good hire a decade into his ownership. Same thing with any of the other generally quiet owners who have won superbowls. They keep their head down, collect mountains of cash, and enjoy the perks of being filthy rich.
NFL owners as a group know very little about the game of football and should have nothing to do with game of football decisions. I like the ones who are content to fleece the paying customers on the business end, and not play amateur football "genius".
I don't know of a single NFL owner who is proactive about winning first, but smart enough to let actual professionals make the decisions.
HPF Bob
10-15-2013, 08:26 PM
And I don't generally re-watch the games but it seems like teams are having their backside DEs stay home and play the boot and we don't have an answer for that. So, what was one of our most successful plays and one of the staples of our offense is now rarely called and when it is, it's a disaster (see Seattle). That's a huge system issue when one of the things you predicate your offense around disappears and there's nothing to take its place.
Perhaps teams have made the conscious decision that they would rather have the backside DE or OLB key the bootleg and give Foster/Tate some bigger cutback lanes believeing a 10-yd gallup by the RB is more desirable than a 20-yd pass to AJ crossing against the flow of the play. That sure seems to explain what the Rams were doing. And if any coach has experience defending Kubiak's offense, it's Jeff Fisher.
chuck
10-16-2013, 12:24 AM
I am fine with that.
Really? No, really?
You view this whole thing as a random lottery?
barrett
10-16-2013, 07:49 AM
Really? No, really?
You view this whole thing as a random lottery?
Not at all. I just think owners have little positive influence and best serve a team by staying out of the way and cutting checks (even if they spend more to make more). McNair does both of those and because of that is no obstacle to winning. Any good head coach could win with an owner like McNair. Even Kubiak with all his flaws has won with McNair as an owner.
BigBull
10-16-2013, 08:36 AM
Not at all. I just think owners have little positive influence and best serve a team by staying out of the way and cutting checks (even if they spend more to make more). McNair does both of those and because of that is no obstacle to winning. Any good head coach could win with an owner like McNair. Even Kubiak with all his flaws has won with McNair as an owner.
^^^this^^^ My only problem with McNair is that in my opinion he is to patient with his coaching staff. I think he needs to put them on a shorter leash.
nunusguy
10-16-2013, 10:37 AM
^^^this^^^ My only problem with McNair is that in my opinion he is to patient with his coaching staff. I think he needs to put them on a shorter leash.
Kubiak is coming off of 2 successive double-digit winning seasons & 2 successive AFC South division championship seasons including 12 wins last year. If McNair were to delay firing Kubiak until after this season is over, would that still be too much patience for you ?
BigBull
10-16-2013, 12:19 PM
Kubiak is coming off of 2 successive double-digit winning seasons & 2 successive AFC South division championship seasons including 12 wins last year. If McNair were to delay firing Kubiak until after this season is over, would that still be too much patience for you ?
I not talking about just this year. I don't think he should have given Kubiak the extention in the first place and this team started falling apart last season. Kubiak should have been fired after the defensive coordinator debacle. I believe he waited to long with Dom Capers too.
Joshua
10-16-2013, 12:29 PM
Throughout his tenure, Kubiak has shown himself to be, at most, an average coach. Both his record and my eyes confirm this. The last 2 years have been pretty good but they were both when the division was an absolute train wreck and only represent 1/4 of his time here.
Throw in the fact that we largely not only lose, but get pummeled when playing quality opponents, I see absolutely no reason to think Kubiak, after 8 years, is going to somehow turn the corner. His time has come. He should be let go at the end of the year and I'm to the point of hoping they don't do anything that would jeopardize this outcome.
barrett
10-16-2013, 01:43 PM
Throughout his tenure, Kubiak has shown himself to be, at most, an average coach. Both his record and my eyes confirm this. The last 2 years have been pretty good but they were both when the division was an absolute train wreck and only represent 1/4 of his time here.
Throw in the fact that we largely not only lose, but get pummeled when playing quality opponents, I see absolutely no reason to think Kubiak, after 8 years, is going to somehow turn the corner. His time has come. He should be let go at the end of the year and I'm to the point of hoping they don't do anything that would jeopardize this outcome.
I agree completely with the 2nd paragraph. I disagree that the division was a mess last year. 2 of the 6 playoff teams were out of the AFC South making it one of the tougher/toughest AFC divisions last year.
barrett
10-16-2013, 01:45 PM
I not talking about just this year. I don't think he should have given Kubiak the extention in the first place and this team started falling apart last season. Kubiak should have been fired after the defensive coordinator debacle. I believe he waited to long with Dom Capers too.
An expansion guy is always going to get a longer hook.
Kubiak could have very eaisly been fired after the 2010 season and had nobody to blame but himself. I was all for it. The last two years made it impossible to fire him in those seasons. Hopefully a losing record this year and he is done.
Joshua
10-16-2013, 03:15 PM
I agree completely with the 2nd paragraph. I disagree that the division was a mess last year. 2 of the 6 playoff teams were out of the AFC South making it one of the tougher/toughest AFC divisions last year.
Well, somebody has to win the division so 1 playoff spot is a given and I can't give too much credit for that. Admittedly, the Colts went 11-5 and grabbed a wild card, but they went 11-5 while giving up more points than they scored. As I understand it, this had never happened before and all of the advanced stats guys think that last year's Colts team was one of the weakest 11-5 teams in history. In any event, we went 1-1 against that team.
But train wreck might have been a little strong.
barrett
10-16-2013, 03:20 PM
Well, somebody has to win the division so 1 playoff spot is a given and I can't give too much credit for that. Admittedly, the Colts went 11-5 and grabbed a wild card, but they went 11-5 while giving up more points than they scored. As I understand it, this had never happened before and all of the advanced stats guys think that last year's Colts team was one of the weakest 11-5 teams in history. In any event, we went 1-1 against that team.
But train wreck might have been a little strong.
I agree the Colts were a weak 11-5, but they were clearly better than the 2nd best team in any other AFC division (bengals, Miami, San Diego). The Bengals were the last playoff team and they got beat up by the free falling Texans.
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