Why we'll keep Mario...

[popanot]

If this regieme won't admit KJ is a weak link and bench him because of his draft status, what makes anyone think they'll let a young, talented, proven #1 overall DE/LB walk? Say what you will about $$, but I think don't think they'll let him walk or trade him for anything other than a huge blockbuster deal at this point. Just sayin'...

[WMH]

Man....I hope your right, but unfortunately, I just don't see it. You can't disregard the dollars associated with Mario's contract. The Texans are/will be cap strapped for the next 2 years. By not signing Mario, it gives them the ability to extend several other key contributors that are expiring in '13 (Schaub, Barwin, Brown come to mind) + bring back Foster, Myers, and Briesel this year.

Don't see a trade being able to work out. We re-sign or he walks.

Not saying that is what I would do, or what I would like to see done, but it sure seems it makes too much sense NOT to re-sign him.

[barrett]

Man....I hope your right, but unfortunately, I just don't see it. You can't disregard the dollars associated with Mario's contract. The Texans are/will be cap strapped for the next 2 years. By not signing Mario, it gives them the ability to extend several other key contributors that are expiring in '13 (Schaub, Barwin, Brown come to mind) + bring back Foster, Myers, and Briesel this year.

Don't see a trade being able to work out. We re-sign or he walks.

Not saying that is what I would do, or what I would like to see done, but it sure seems it makes too much sense NOT to re-sign him.

Where are you getting the idea the Texans are cap strapped if they resign Mario?

His cap number will go significantly down with any long term deal. Maybe as much as $5-10 million less than the $18 million this year.

And the salary cap explodes next year based on increased TV revenue. Meaning even if we were tight this year we would have money next year before we needed to worry about any 2013 guys.

[Joshua]

Where are you getting the idea the Texans are cap strapped if they resign Mario?

His cap number will go significantly down with any long term deal. Maybe as much as $5-10 million less than the $18 million this year.

And the salary cap explodes next year based on increased TV revenue. Meaning even if we were tight this year we would have money next year before we needed to worry about any 2013 guys.

Agree with all of this with one exception/question. I read somewhere that it's 2014, not 2013, when the cap will take off because of the new TV deal. Not sure it changes the calculus much, but if anyone knows the answer I would appreciate it.

[nunusguy]

I've heard the new TV deal will be fed into the cap incrementally instead of in the form of a big pop the first year the cash-flow from the networks become effective. And regardless I think it's a bad deal if we have to give Mario a contract that includes from 35 to as much as 50 M guaranteed money. I don't think he's worth that kind of money and wonder if he's really more valuable to the team than other players who become FAs in '13 like Duane Brown and
Connor Barwin, not to mention Schaub ?

[barrett]

You're not sure if Mario is more valuable than Barwin?

[WMH]

Where are you getting the idea the Texans are cap strapped if they resign Mario?

His cap number will go significantly down with any long term deal. Maybe as much as $5-10 million less than the $18 million this year.

And the salary cap explodes next year based on increased TV revenue. Meaning even if we were tight this year we would have money next year before we needed to worry about any 2013 guys.

IIRC - Cap grows by leaps and bounds in '14, not '13.

It is being reported that we have ~$3-$4MM in cap room, that is with Mario at ~$18. Say Mario gets.........$12MM/yr (-$6MM). Arian gets......$6MM/yr (+$5MM). Myers gets......$4MM/yr (+$1MM). The cap "savings" you get from a long term Mario contract is eaten up by Arian and Myers deals, plus we still have to resign Briesel. Dressen might have to walk as well.

I'll be the first to admit, I haven't a clue what I am talking about when it comes to the cap, but in just looking at the raw numbers, it seems to me that the above example will likely hold fairly true. This puts us in the exact same spot next year when they go to re-up Brown, Barwin, and Schaub (might be others as well....Antonio Smith? Wade Smith?). Another year in Wade's system, and Barwin is going to command top dollar as well.

That's just the way I see it. Hope I am wrong, but that sure makes sense to me.

[HPF Bob]

In the games after Mario went down, were there any where we were dominated by the other team's offense? Really, the Carolina game was all I could think of and that, I think, was just a flat performance all around.

Granted, we didn't really play many great offenses either but I thought the defense did very well with Mario on the sidelines. I don't want to see him leave and get nothing in return nor do I want him to leave if contracts can be arranged where he stays without costing us other key players but I think we can survive without him if it came to that. I think we already have.

[barrett]

IIRC - Cap grows by leaps and bounds in '14, not '13.

It is being reported that we have ~$3-$4MM in cap room, that is with Mario at ~$18. Say Mario gets.........$12MM/yr (-$6MM). Arian gets......$6MM/yr (+$5MM). Myers gets......$4MM/yr (+$1MM). The cap "savings" you get from a long term Mario contract is eaten up by Arian and Myers deals, plus we still have to resign Briesel. Dressen might have to walk as well.

I'll be the first to admit, I haven't a clue what I am talking about when it comes to the cap, but in just looking at the raw numbers, it seems to me that the above example will likely hold fairly true. This puts us in the exact same spot next year when they go to re-up Brown, Barwin, and Schaub (might be others as well....Antonio Smith? Wade Smith?). Another year in Wade's system, and Barwin is going to command top dollar as well.

That's just the way I see it. Hope I am wrong, but that sure makes sense to me.

I doubt Mario's cap number would be as high as 12 million. If he signs a 6 year $72 million deal (a huge one), it is not spread equally over 6 years. It is hugely back loaded. This is why he got $18 million in the last year of this past deal. That was a 6 year $54 million dollar deal and a full ONE THIRD of it was in the last year. I would bet a long term deal for Mario puts him under $10 million for cap purposes next year.

[barrett]

In the games after Mario went down, were there any where we were dominated by the other team's offense? Really, the Carolina game was all I could think of and that, I think, was just a flat performance all around.

Granted, we didn't really play many great offenses either but I thought the defense did very well with Mario on the sidelines. I don't want to see him leave and get nothing in return nor do I want him to leave if contracts can be arranged where he stays without costing us other key players but I think we can survive without him if it came to that. I think we already have.

If your argument is we never got dominated without him, I don't know what to say. I am pretty sure not getting dominated doesn't get anyone superbowl trophies.

The NY Giants just beat Tom Brady for the 2nd time in 5 years and they did it with pure pass rush both times. Nobody in NY was saying lets get rid of Osi or Tuck since we have Kiwanuka and JPP. They said lets rotate them when necessary and play all four when possible. And they rode that plan all the way to a superbowl despite a terrible secondary and no running game.

New England has an even easier schedule next year and there is probably little chance we get to a superbowl without beating Brady. The only way to do that is to hit him over and over, and letting Mario go or trading him is the opposite of that. And if we reach the superbowl we are likely to find Rodgers or Brees waiting for us.

The NFL is a QB league. And the only way around having one of the 3-4 elite guys is to have a QB killing team.

[WMH]

I doubt Mario's cap number would be as high as 12 million. If he signs a 6 year $72 million deal (a huge one), it is not spread equally over 6 years. It is hugely back loaded. This is why he got $18 million in the last year of this past deal. That was a 6 year $54 million dollar deal and a full ONE THIRD of it was in the last year. I would bet a long term deal for Mario puts him under $10 million for cap purposes next year.

I hear ya, but I'm thinking that his numbers are going to be quite a bit bigger than that. IIRC, Peppers got a 6 yr, $80ishMM ($40ish guarranteed) contract two years ago....that was before teams had to start inching towards a salary floor. Charles Johnson (yeah, who?) 6 yrs, $76MM ($32MM gtd.). It is quite possible that if he hits the market, it would/could be the biggest FA deal for a DE ever.....not good for the hometeam :(

[cadams]

if they can get mario at a reasonable number (reasonable for the caliber player he is, not reasonable in real world) and get foster resigned, i bet they can make the cap work to get most of the others back. they can convert parts of otehr player's salaries for 2012 into signing bonuses (bringing their base salary down to league minimuim) and spread that out over the next few years. that would drop cap figures and allow them to get the people back they want.

my thought is they keep everyone, with the only wild card being how much mario wants. if he wants to be the highest paid d-end in the league, he will be playing somewhere else. and unfortunately, one of the teams who has a ton of cap space and a need on d-line is tennessee.

[nunusguy]

You're not sure if Mario is more valuable than Barwin?
I think Mario is perhaps only marginally better than Barwin as a 3-4 OLB, but the really significant consideration is value and since we can likely resign Barwin in the 2012-13 free agency for only half the monetary consideration that Mario will command this year, and that's also assuming that Connor has his second consecutive double-digit sack season, it seems foolish to me to pull out all of the stops to retain Mario.

[cadams]

if barwin has another double-digit sack season he will probably get less than mario will, but i don't think it will be as low as half of what mario will command.

i will say this, i would love to see what wade could cook up on long passing downs that would have mario, barwin and reed in the game at the same time.

[nunusguy]

The NY Giants just beat Tom Brady for the 2nd time in 5 years and they did it with pure pass rush both times.

They did it because the Pats couldn't catch the ball in a clutch situation.

[barrett]

I think Mario is perhaps only marginally better than Barwin as a 3-4 OLB, but the really significant consideration is value and since we can likely resign Barwin in the 2012-13 free agency for only half the monetary consideration that Mario will command this year, and that's also assuming that Connor has his second consecutive double-digit sack season, it seems foolish to me to pull out all of the stops to retain Mario.

Jason Babin got $30 million after 5 years of nothing and one year with 13 sacks on a losing team. If Barwin puts up a 2nd consecutive double digit sack season, on a winning team (superbowl), just as salaries are increasing, he will see at least $50 million. And if he doesn't put up double digit sacks it is not a marginal difference between Mario and him.

But I don't see why it is one or the other. In no way does resigning Mario mean Barwin walks down the road. Like I said, the Giants prove a defense does not have two pass rushers. They have 4+ and it works. The Ravens don't have 4 and the Patriots OL swallowed up Suggs. The AFC Championship runs through New England almost every year, and their is a blueprint to beating them. Kill the QB. There is no way cutting Walter and JJ (nearly $5 million combined), or extending someone else to defer big salaries until 2014 (they could do this easily with Mario) is not a better idea than giving up our best pass rusher.

[Arky]

From what I gather, Wade is really high on Mario - likes him a lot.... So, it will be interesting so see which way they go with #90....

[nunusguy]

Jason Babin got $30 million after 5 years of nothing and one year with 13 sacks on a losing team. If Barwin puts up a 2nd consecutive double digit sack season, on a winning team (superbowl), just as salaries are increasing, he will see at least $50 million. And if he doesn't put up double digit sacks it is not a marginal difference between Mario and him.

Babin gets a five-year deal that will pay $28 million with around $5-6 million guaranteed.
http://phillysportscentral.com/eagles/eagles-sign-defensive-end-jason-babin-to-5-year-28-million-contract.html
***********************
Babin only got 5-6 M guaranteed money last summer when he signed with Philly, but I would expect Barwin to get 3 times that if he has another good season this Fall which will as I said and expect be only 'bout half of the guaranteed money Mario might expect soon.
C'mon man, I think you know the guaranteed coin is what everybody pays attention to, that other stuff is all basically "funny money".

[barrett]

The other stuff might be funny money, if you plan to cut a guy before the contract runs out. If you sign a young guy like Barwin you are only cutting him if something goes wrong and he does not perform. If you don't plan on him playing out his contract then you certainly don't cut Mario Williams.

Not to mention the total contract and salary per year is what affects the cap number which is what we are talking about here.

If Barwin gets 5 years for $15-20 million gauranteed (with say 50 total), and Mario is at 6 years and 40 million gauranteed (and 80) total, then the cap number is not that different. One contract spreads it out to 10 million a year and the other to 13 million.

Obviously the deal with the lower gaurantee lets you get out of it easier, but that only matters if you care about future cap health (like 3-5 years down the road if you think one of these guys might be cut and the un-amortized bonus counts), or if you are worried about the health of Bob McNair's wallet.

Neither of those things should matter for a team that wants to win a superbowl next year. Spend the money and figure out the future in the future (when the cap skyrockets anyways, not to mention contracts will skyrocket in a few years with the salary floor, meaning Barwin's deal could be much bigger since everyone has to spend).

[Nconroe]

We're all speculating on what 2012 salary cap will be and what Texans current salary cap number is. Plus, they need to be under whatever the new number is on March 13 and then again somewhere when season begins, other times I think things can temporarily be over or under.

Here is a link to a place that thinks Texans currently sit at $116 mil
http://blogs.sun-sentinel.com/sports_football_dolphins/2012/02/nfl-salary-cap-projections-for-2012-season.html

Here is a link that has current core Texans salaries at $90 mil total
http://www.sportscity.com/NFL/Houston-Texans-Salaries

I hope for sure Texans can keep all their top free agents and think they likely can do that, including Mario, Arian, Chris and a few others.

[HPF Bob]

From the above Sun-Sentinal link:

The salary cap for 2012 has not been set, but it is projected to be between $121-125 million, with teams being able to borrow another $2 million from future caps. Therefore, we’ll safely project the salary cap to be at $124 million in ’12. But please understand this is an estimation.

If Mario was already at $13 million and then we're $4-8 mill under the cap, then I hope we can simply fit Mario into a deal that doesn't raise that number at all and use the money on Foster who will get a big raise.

[barrett]

I think Mario was at $18 million last year. An $8-12 million cap number is reasonable on even a huge long term deal.

So the $6-10 million less he'll count next year plus the cap increase should allow us to do what we want. Especially if we dump JJ and a few others for younger/cheaper alternatives.

[dalemurphy]

If your argument is we never got dominated without him, I don't know what to say. I am pretty sure not getting dominated doesn't get anyone superbowl trophies.

The NY Giants just beat Tom Brady for the 2nd time in 5 years and they did it with pure pass rush both times. Nobody in NY was saying lets get rid of Osi or Tuck since we have Kiwanuka and JPP. They said lets rotate them when necessary and play all four when possible. And they rode that plan all the way to a superbowl despite a terrible secondary and no running game.

New England has an even easier schedule next year and there is probably little chance we get to a superbowl without beating Brady. The only way to do that is to hit him over and over, and letting Mario go or trading him is the opposite of that. And if we reach the superbowl we are likely to find Rodgers or Brees waiting for us.

The NFL is a QB league. And the only way around having one of the 3-4 elite guys is to have a QB killing team.


In the 4 games with Mario: 325 yards per game.
In the 14 games without: 255 yards per game.

Yes, Mario played against New Orleans. However, also included in those four games are games against an awful Indy offense and a really bad Miami offense. The defense was better without him. Now, there are other factors than just his absence that affected those numbers. Still, 14 games without him and the defense was great in almost everyone (except the first game after his injury and the two games without Wade Phillips).

[NBT]

According to Lance Z with the chronic, Foster is not averse to the franchise tag.

[edo783]

According to Lancee Z with the chronic, Foster is not averse to the franchise tag.

The more I hear on the kid, the more I like him. He seems to have his head on pretty straight and knows that 8-10 mill that is for sure money is life changing money and perhaps could even be considered generational money. His agent indicated that they saw it as reasonable and a means of getting to the long term deal. I love how the kid runs, I love that he doesn't think he is bigger than the game or that the game "Owes' him a golden life, but I really like his sense of humor.

[Arky]

The more I hear on the kid, the more I like him. He seems to have his head on pretty straight and knows that 8-10 mill that is for sure money is life changing money and perhaps could even be considered generational money. His agent indicated that they saw it as reasonable and a means of getting to the long term deal. I love how the kid runs, I love that he doesn't think he is bigger than the game or that the game "Owes' him a golden life, but I really like his sense of humor.

Ya, he's getting very popular league-wide. Always popping up on NFL Network and ESPN for comments.... He's been an excellent ambassador for the Texans and getting people to recognize the Texans. I sometimes visit NFL betting forums and the ESPN gaming forums - a pretty jaded crowd - and most everybody has big respect for Foster. They think he's "the man".... ;)

[NBT]

Sometimes Arian Foster sounds almost too good to be true. I hope that when push comes to shove, that Arian is really that good ( from a signing standpoint, of course).

[WMH]

Saw this earlier, sure don't see how this will help us keep Mario, or the others for that matter:
@JRRickert: San Diego Chargers and Houston Texans elected not to carry over 2011 salary cap room to 2012 --

Granted, its "only" a reported $3MM-$4MM, my question is Why Not?

In thier pressers, both Kubiak and Smith declared he remains a priority, why not put every bit of ammo you can in your gun?

Don't understand the logic behind that, especially in the situation we are reported to be in.

[nunusguy]

Saw this earlier, sure don't see how this will help us keep Mario, or the others for that matter:
@JRRickert: San Diego Chargers and Houston Texans elected not to carry over 2011 salary cap room to 2012 --

Granted, its "only" a reported $3MM-$4MM, my question is Why Not?

In thier pressers, both Kubiak and Smith declared he remains a priority, why not put every bit of ammo you can in your gun?

Don't understand the logic behind that, especially in the situation we are reported to be in.
Why is it so difficult for people to understand that Mario is gone ?

[WMH]

Why is it so difficult for people to understand that Mario is gone ?

Its not that I don't think he's a goner (cause I do) , its more a question of why they aren't carrying over available cap space. They have other issues besides Mario.

[cadams]

is this confirmed? i cannot imagine that they did not.

[WMH]

is this confirmed? i cannot imagine that they did not.

That was the only place I saw that info, haven't seen it pop up from the local parrots. Who knows.

PFT had a report the other day that we were at $118.9MM for the top 51 players under contract. It also listed the carryover at $1.08MM. Not as much as I had thought, but still don't understand why they wouldn't do it, if that report was true.

Question for you cap people - If we are truly sitting at $118.9, is Mario, Myers, Dressen, etc. included in that figure? I'm thinking not, since they are technically not under contract, but don't know for sure.

[Warren]

Mario was not franchised, and according to PFT (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/05/no-serious-discussions-between-texans-mario-williams/) there haven't been serious discussions between his agent and the Texans.

Question for you cap people - If we are truly sitting at $118.9, is Mario, Myers, Dressen, etc. included in that figure? I'm thinking not, since they are technically not under contract, but don't know for sure.
From the same article:As of last Tuesday, the Texans had $118.9 in 2012 salary-cap commitments, which puts them close to the expected ceiling of $120 million or so. Foster wasn’t factored into the “top 51″ calculation, since he wasn’t under contract at the time. His cap number for 2012 will land on the “top 51″ list, nudging a minimum-salary guy off the board and taking more dollars away from the team’s allotment.So players not under contract with the team for 2012 weren't included.

[Nconroe]

only thing is, Arian was under contract as a RFA through next year and was our 43rd highest salary before today. so what else not correct in that source. I wish I could see who those 51 or 53 current players under contract are and how that adds up to 118k or so?

It does look difficult to keep Mario unless there is one big home town discount the first two years, but why do that if you are Mario? I woiuld like to see Mario stay. Should be very interesting between now and Mar. 13th.

[WMH]

only thing is, Arian was under contract as a RFA through next year and was our 43rd highest salary before today. so what else not correct in that source. I wish I could see who those 51 or 53 current players under contract are and how that adds up to 118k or so?

It does look difficult to keep Mario unless there is one big home town discount the first two years, but why do that if you are Mario? I woiuld like to see Mario stay. Should be very interesting between now and Mar. 13th.

Not 100% sure on this, but because he was technically a FA (RFA in this case), he actually wasn't under contract for the '12 season. Tender never materialized, so it is a mute point. If he would have been tendered, then that would be his hit.

[Nconroe]

Ok, could be, but I still have questions.

If you also remove Mario, smith, rackers, Dreesen, Brisel salaries seems like you ought to currently be about 25 mil under the cap?

Lots of those lower salaries ought to be gone to fron current count like two extra QZb or practice squad guys?

[popanot]

If you also remove Mario, smith, rackers, Dreesen, Brisel salaries seems like you ought to currently be about 25 mil under the cap?Sure those contracts go away, but perhaps you're not factoring in the escalation other contracts. I'm sure other player contracts - like Cushing, Ryans, Barwin, Schaub, AJ, etc., etc., on down the line - are going up, so that's eating into the current cap figure.

[Joshua]

Sure those contracts go away, but perhaps you're not factoring in the escalation other contracts. I'm sure other player contracts - like Cushing, Ryans, Barwin, Schaub, AJ, etc., etc., on down the line - are going up, so that's eating into the current cap figure.

The more I think about it, I don't understand why we're in such cap hell. We don't have a really expensive QB. Most of our better players are still on their rookie contracts and, if anything, are substantially underpaid (Brown, Cushing, Barwin, Watt, Reed, and until yesterday Foster).

[HPF Bob]

The more I think about it, I don't understand why we're in such cap hell. We don't have a really expensive QB. Most of our better players are still on their rookie contracts and, if anything, are substantially underpaid (Brown, Cushing, Barwin, Watt, Reed, and until yesterday Foster).

But those are counterbalanced by the contract for AJ and Ryans plus the free agent signings of Joseph, Manning, Antonio Smith, Wade Smith and Shawn Cody. I don't know all the numbers on the contracts but I know we signed an FA for several years in a row, most of them probably back-loaded.

[Nconroe]

well, this cap availability is sure confusing, but a few references to give some hope we can get some things done maybe

this one has salaries and shows us at 107mil incl signing Arian estimate, presumably top 38 players
http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/houston-texans/cap-hit/

this one says we have about 25mil available.
http://torotimes.com/2012/03/01/offseason3/

this one explains how we might have like 20 mil available, along with some of the cba rules
http://www.battleredblog.com/2012/3/6/2817542/making-sense-of-dollars-a-salary-cap-primer-applied-to-your-houston

some actual player contract info can be found here, may list more than 38 players,
http://www.rotoworld.com/teams/contracts/nfl/hou/

[Nconroe]

Sounds like Andre reworked his contract to give Texans 4.5 mil extra cap space this year. Thanks Andre. wonder what's next?
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/08/andre-johnson-dez-bryant-restructure-their-contracts/

[popanot]

Supposedly Jabba McLain is disputing this. Not sure whether to believe one over the other since they're both awful. LaCanfora has been wrong on numerous occasions just over the past couple of weeks.

[WMH]

The more I think about it, I don't understand why we're in such cap hell. We don't have a really expensive QB. Most of our better players are still on their rookie contracts and, if anything, are substantially underpaid (Brown, Cushing, Barwin, Watt, Reed, and until yesterday Foster).

From what I heard on the radio, alot of the restructures done last year in order to sign Joeseph and Manning were pushed into this year.

The team has never been way below the cap, and has usually spent the majority of it. When you rob Peter to pay Paul, it eventually catches up with you. PIT is a perfect case in point, look at all the slashing they had to do. While we will likely do quite a bit again this year, eventually it will catch up with us, unless the cap truly does grow by leaps and bounds, we "might" skate on by.....

[Nconroe]

did you follow some of those links to Texans player salaries and contacts, so, easy to see how things don't add up, but could be there are hidden bonuses to account for this year.

anyways, we should know a lot more about next Tuesday or shortly thereafter at latest on our highly regarded FA's.

[NBT]

Perhaps, if they had drafted better for defensive secondary, they wouldn't be in this situation?

[Keith]

Mario visiting the Bills tonight.

Bills typically not a team to spend a lot of cash, since they don't have it usually. But I imagine they need to fill some cap space.

[nunusguy]

Mario visiting the Bills tonight.

Bills typically not a team to spend a lot of cash, since they don't have it usually. But I imagine they need to fill some cap space.
Funny I didn't realize the Bills were a big-time playoff contender, because I know Mario wouldn't be talking to them just because of the money.

[WMH]

Bills have a 1:30 presser to announce Mario Williams signing, per sources. -- Chris Mortensen (@mortreport)

[coloradodude]

Bye Mario.

If I'm in the AFC East, I'm running the ball right at him every play. Heck, I'd even use the wishbone formation a couple of times just to let the GM of the Bills know what a mistake he made.

Over paid...over rated.

[coloradodude]

Mario Williams deal finally done in Buffalo

The Buffalo Bills have finally landed Mario Williams after three days of talks according to Chris Mortensen of ESPN.

The move will be officially announced at a 12:30PM ET press conference. Contract terms are not yet available, but the Bills are widely expected to make Williams the highest-paid defensive player in NFL history. Bears RE Julius Peppers has held the honor since March 2010, when he signed a six-year, $84 million deal that included $42 million guaranteed. It's a safe bet Williams' deal will dwarf those numbers.

Jay Glazer of FOXSports reports the deal includes a staggering $50 million guaranteed, making it the largest free-agent contract ever signed by an NFL player. It's a six-year deal with a maximum value of $100 million.

////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////


So this guy is better than Julius Peppers? I've watched Peppers get triple teamed. Mediocre tackles can handle Williams by themselves.

Mario Williams may have the BEST agent in NFL history.

[Keith]

I liked Mario, thought he got too much unfair criticism related to being picked ahead of Bush and Young and later for a couple injuries. But I think it says something when a team lets their first round pick hit the open market like this. It doesn't happen often for a player of Mario's caliber, esp one with a #1 overall pick pedigree.

Pass rush wins championships though. It will be interesting to see how the Texans respond. I like Barwin and Reed, too, but that's not enough.

[barrett]

Not an ideal end game, but the right decision at the moment. I have no idea if Mario was open to a more reasonable extension in the last year, but we could not pay what buffalo did.

I think good deal for buffalo though. They have to spend to the cap ceiling and nobody good ever wants to take there money.

[chuck]

I liked Mario, thought he got too much unfair criticism related to being picked ahead of Bush and Young and later for a couple injuries. But I think it says something when a team lets their first round pick hit the open market like this. It doesn't happen often for a player of Mario's caliber, esp one with a #1 overall pick pedigree.

I'm still trying to work backwards on this. The team had to know after last year's FA signings that it would be nearly impossible to re-sign Mario this year. They had no idea how Wade's defense would perform, nor did they know whether Barwin and Reed would produce. Of course they didn't yet know about Reed, nor that he would be pressed into action.

It seems pretty clear that they have known for at least a full year that they would not be able to re-sign Mario. I wonder what would have happened if Mario had stayed healthy and put up 16 sacks.

[Joshua]

Agree that there is no way the Texans could match what Buffalo put on the table. Like others have said, if there is a complaint, it was that the Texans allowed it to get to this point.

Honestly, I can't believe they didn't renegotiate him 2 years ago because his cap number has been so large the last 2 years. I suspect he would have taken a 6 year deal with about $30 mill guaranteed 2 years ago and this would have locked him up long term and lowered his cap number the last 2 years to boot.

For good or bad, he was probably the best player on our defense for the last 5 years. To see him walk, in his prime, with nothing in return stings. I find it hard to believe it had to come to this. I've seen several comparisons to Reggie White hitting free agency. Now, clearly, Mario is not Reggie White but it does say something when people have to go back 20 years to find an analogous situation. Suggests maybe the Texans dropped the ball.

[nunusguy]

boot.

For good or bad, he was probably the best player on our defense for the last 5 years.
I think that statement might get you a couple arguments.

[NBT]

If the Texans did know they were not going to resign Mario last year (and by going $20M over for other FAs, that seems pretty evident), hindsight would seem to make them pretty smart. I guess they figured they didn't want to pay top money for an often injured player.

[Joshua]

I think that statement might get you a couple arguments.

Clearly opinions may vary, although I don't know who, other than maybe Demeco, that people would argue was a bigger part of our defense over the last 5 years. And, in my defense, I think Mario's deal today supports me, since nobody else on our defense, if released today, would be getting a $100 million dollar contract. :p

[chuck]

I think it's fair to say that Mario was certainly the defense's best player over the last five years. I can't think of anyone else who comes close. I would also expect that there are several Texans defenders who will make a larger overall impact than will Mario over the next five years.

[TheMatrix31]

Sad to see Mario go, but it's foolish for anyone to grab him at that price.

We'll roll with our boys.

[edo783]

Loved Mario when he was on and hate to see him go, but for the club this is the right thing. My ONLY real concern on the front 7 is depth and quality of the rotation. If we lose Meyers also, that puts major strain on the draft to be a home run. I would take the Koch (sp) kid out of Wisconsin with the first pick and then best convertable or already an OLB with the 2nd. Not the way I would have wanted to play the 1st two picks, but ya have to play the cards as they are delt to you.

[nunusguy]

Sad to see Mario go, but it's foolish for anyone to grab him at that price.

We'll roll with our boys.
Couldn't agree more, it is sad to see him leave but the going-price was ridiculous and I would have been upset with the Texans had the price they paid been anything like because he's just not worth it to us.
When Winston was cut I was for sure stunned, but it didn't occur to me that it was anything but an isolated situation. Then came Myers and Breisel, neither of whom were resigned and allowed to seek work else where, and that's when I became convinced that Smith and his cap guy Olsen have failed to understand and/or mismanaged the new CBA as it relates to player compensation.
This is a major breakdown and one of the few things that could sabotage Texans momentum going into the 2012 season.

[barrett]

Couldn't agree more, it is sad to see him leave but the going-price was ridiculous and I would have been upset with the Texans had the price they paid been anything like because he's just not worth it to us.
When Winston was cut I was for sure stunned, but it didn't occur to me that it was anything but an isolated situation. Then came Myers and Breisel, neither of whom were resigned and allowed to seek work else where, and that's when I became convinced that Smith and his cap guy Olsen have failed to understand and/or mismanaged the new CBA as it relates to player compensation.
This is a major breakdown and one of the few things that could sabotage Texans momentum going into the 2012 season.

OH NO. When did Breisel and Meyers leave? How did I miss that?

[popanot]

Look, it's obviously a huge gamble letting these guys hit the market, but it could actually payoff in that these guys dont get offered the $$ they thought they would. It's kind of hard to complain about being in cap hell and then on the other hand say we should have offered Myers/Brisiel contracts before allowing the market determine their value. What if we renegotiated, overpaid, and thus went even deeper into cap hell? What's worse? Maybe we end up re-signing these guy far cheaper than we originally thought? The Texans obliviously feel it's a gamble worth taking so I guess we need to trust their judgement for now.

[nunusguy]

OH NO. When did Breisel and Meyers leave? How did I miss that?
OK that's fair, but you know as well as I do when these guys get the opportunity to go shopping it's often sayonara. Not always, but often they get sat down in another teams office and don't leave until they've inked a new deal.
I bet we lose Myers, and if I'm mistaken I'll acknowledge that I initially overreacted to his situation. I hope I get that chance to do so ?

[barrett]

OK that's fair, but you know as well as I do when these guys get the opportunity to go shopping it's often sayonara. Not always, but often they get sat down in another teams office and don't leave until they've inked a new deal.
I bet we lose Myers, and if I'm mistaken I'll acknowledge that I initially overreacted to his situation. I hope I get that chance to do so ?

Guys who sign early in FA get overpaid. Guys who sign a week in are paid about right. Guys who sign late get veteran minimum or little more. It is a good sign that Meyers and Breisel are still out there. We may still lose one or both, but the more time goes by the better our chances. I have to believe both know they are better here than they would be elsewhere. So if we can come close on the money we should have a good chance.

But either way I would not overpay for Meyers, Breisel, Winston, or Smith. Brown is the only guy with real talent. Meyers was looking at being replaced and hated by our fans 3 years ago before we got Foster. I remember him being placed into Slaton's lap by the opposing DT numerous times that year. I think he has improved, but even so, I won't declare the sky is falling if we lose him. Especially not until I see how we replace him if he goes.

We should get Breisel back cheap and we shouldn't lose much at RT with Butler (who filled in admirably for a better player at a tougher position). If we find a credible replacement in the draft/FA for Meyers or we bring him back, then I won't be concerned about our OL.

To me bringing back Foster was far more important than anything else this offseason.

[HPF Bob]

The problem with letting the market determine their value is that all it take is one of the other 31 clubs to overvalue your player and you've lost him.

I do know this - there's no way in hell we're taking a WR now in the first round. We have too many other needs and we kept Jacoby and Walter which means Smith valued them more than he did the o-linemen and FB he released or didn't re-sign.

To all of you who whine about Jacoby and Walter (including me) , the Texans obviously don't agree with you.

[barrett]

I think jacoby still gets replaced in the end. It doesn't take a first rounder to catch punts properly and be within 3 yards of where the QB expects you to be.

I bet Walter survives for continuity's sake (especially if JJ goes). He lines up at all the wr spots and they love touse him as a blocker. He's honestly as big a part of the run game as OD. I'd dump him if he didn't take a pay cut, but Kubs has always loved him.

Or it could be a case of one will be replaced but they won't know which one until after the draft.

[Warren]

The Bills also signed Mark Anderson. Since they're apparently trying to reassemble the 2010 Texan defense, I wonder what they'd be willing to give up for Kareem?