Texans Interested In Leinart?

[HPF Bob]

Texans Among Leaders For Leinart (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/13888368/reports-texans-among-leaders-to-pick-up-leinart)

If he's signed for dirt cheap, I suppose he's an upgrade over DanO but - sheesh - I'm not sure we should go anywhere near him.

[TheMatrix31]

Dude is absolutely toxic. No chance in hell!

[Bigtinylittle]

In my opinion, stories like this in the national press are usually generated either by a reporter who is engaging in speculation just to generate a cheap story, or are planted by a player's agent trying to get a little competition going for his client.

I certainly hope it's one of those two, because I don't think Leinart is a good fit for the Texans. I wouldn't mind another QB being brought in, though.

[nunusguy]

610 just reporting we've signed Leinert to a 1-year deal and their source is ESPN they say. Can't find a link yet, but will keep looking.

[Arky]

610 just reporting we've signed Leinert to a 1-year deal and their source is ESPN they say. Can't find a link yet, but will keep looking.

Somewhere, Dan Pastorini is smiling....

[nunusguy]

Matt Leinart is about to become a Houston Texan.

Chris Mortensen of ESPN is reporting that Leinart, the free agent quarterback released by the Cardinals this weekend, has agreed to terms with the Texans on a one-year deal.

In Houston, Leinart won't have any chance of unseating the starter, Matt Schaub, so he has apparently accepted the fact that he has to be a backup, at least for now. Really, he had no other choice.

But the good news for Leinart is that if he practices well and learns the offense quickly, it shouldn't take too much to unseat the current No. 2 quarterback in Houston, Dan Orlovsky. Orlovsky looked terrible in the preseason, and Leinart should be an upgrade for the Texans at the backup quarterback position.

And if Leinart isn't even an upgrade over Orlovsky, his NFL stock has fallen even further than any of us thought.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/09/06/matt-leinart-agrees-to-deal-with-houston-texans/

[Bigtinylittle]

If it's just a one year deal then I guess I really don't mind it. It looks like the deal we had with Grossman last year. We're buying an insurance policy.

If Orlovsky hadn't thrown those two picks Thursday night, I'm guessing we wouldn't be making this deal. Those picks were scary bad, especially because they weren't innacurate throws and there wasn't any pressure coming from the DL. They were just really stupid decisions. Especially for a QB in his fifth year as a pro. Orlovsky has said that Kubiak has told him a thousand times his main job is to protect the ball. I guess he hasn't told him enough times yet.

I'm thinking we get a QB in the draft this year.

[Nconroe]

I just heard on ESPN as well that we signed Leinert. I sure hope Leinert is ready to grow up, take some teamwork and humble pie. I guess it shows how poor Orlavsky really looked as well.

[popanot]

They were probably hoping Sage would be available, and when that didn't happen, went with the next 'best' option. I don't think there's a soul in town who felt even slightly comfortable going w/DanO. At least Leinart hasn't shown a tendency to throw the INT and usually (always) checks down protecting the ball. Leinart's sort of like David Carr w/o the scrambling out of bounds behind the LOS. Not a bad move for a 1yr look and some 'minor'insurance.

[HPF Bob]

My problem is signing a lefthander to back up a righthander. The spin on the pass will be reverse and the right side of the OL turns into the blind side if Leinart comes in.

My best hope is that Schaub stays healthy and we flip Leinart to a team later in the season who is desperate due to injuries. If we got a fifth or a sixth for him, that we be great (presuming there's a draft next spring).

[dalemurphy]

My problem is signing a lefthander to back up a righthander. The spin on the pass will be reverse and the right side of the OL turns into the blind side if Leinart comes in.

My best hope is that Schaub stays healthy and we flip Leinart to a team later in the season who is desperate due to injuries. If we got a fifth or a sixth for him, that we be great (presuming there's a draft next spring).

good news, Bob: There will be a draft next year... Probably no football. But, the draft is taking place no matter what.

[popanot]

At least Leinart hasn't shown a tendency to throw the INT...Let me retract that statement. :)

[painekiller]

My problem is signing a lefthander to back up a righthander. The spin on the pass will be reverse and the right side of the OL turns into the blind side if Leinart comes in.

My best hope is that Schaub stays healthy and we flip Leinart to a team later in the season who is desperate due to injuries. If we got a fifth or a sixth for him, that we be great (presuming there's a draft next spring).

The spin of the ball is overrated. It is different but it does not change the basics of catching a football. This is not like a baseball. Most lefties throw a more catchable ball.

Now the protection and the roll outs change. That is a concern.

And Leinart has cement shoes, just what we need another slow footed QB. I will say his on the field stuff is better than Orlovsky, it's his off the field stuff that I am not interested in.

If he can be used to trade to desperate team by the trade deadline than this is a good move. And as a 3rd string QB, he is better than most, and if a team is down to #3 they are done anyway.

[Roy P]

I'm thinking we get a QB in the draft this year.

Getting Leinart isn't a bad idea, if we cut Orlovsky and the Ex-Cardinal becomes the backup. Hopefully, Rick Smith has JD Booty on his speed dial, just in case we trade Leinart during the season. I just don't see that happening as of today.

I will be putting Alabama Crimson Tide QB Greg McElroy on my draft board though.

[chuck]

The spin of the ball is overrated. It is different but it does not change the basics of catching a football.

Dude. This is Bob's favorite thing to obsess about. After nearly ten years you should surely know that by now. Every time a left handed quarterback is mentioned Bob leaps up with the concern that the spin is different. I promise you I was laughing to myself about this last night thinking that if the Texans expressed any interest in Leinart you could take it to the bank that Bob would weigh in with the spin business like he always does. Sure enough, he did not disappoint.

And I for one would be perfectly comfortable with Winston protecting a QB's blindside. Let's hope he never has to.

[HPF Bob]

Dude. This is Bob's favorite thing to obsess about.

If you knew anything about me, you'd know I obsess about the slow white boy reverse, not the lefthanded QB. I haven't obsessed about that since Tony Banks.

[Roy P]

If you knew anything about me, you'd know I obsess about the slow white boy reverse, not the lefthanded QB. I haven't obsessed about that since Tony Banks.

Did you see the Reverse they ran with Dorin Dickerson? He had a huge gain, and I even made a comment about it during the Game Thread. I knew you'd be excited to see it being run by some NON-slow white boy. :D

[chuck]

If you knew anything about me, you'd know I obsess about the slow white boy reverse, not the lefthanded QB. I haven't obsessed about that since Tony Banks.

You know perfectly well that any and every time anyone mentions a lefthanded QB in relation to the Texans you remind everyone that as far as you're concerned it's a dicey idea because of the reverse spin. It reached a fever pitch around Dave Ragone but that's but one of many examples.

I'm not complaining, mind you, just amused and somewhat comforted. If you quit chiming in on the topic I'd start to worry about you. More than I already do I mean.

And I'm right there with you on the end-around play regardless of whether the ball carrier is slow or non-slow.

[HPF Bob]

If you're going to run the reverse at all, why not put it in the hands of burners like Jacoby Jones or Andre Davis? That just seems blatantly obvious to me. Give it to somebody who can actually turn the corner and outrun defenders, particularly since they are already on the roster.

Running it with the slow receiver makes as much sense as running a play where Andre Johnson throws a pass. Now OD is a former quarterback, If you want to run a TE reverse using Daniels with a pass option, I could maybe go for that. Maybe.

[painekiller]

You do know that the reverse is not designed to work every time, right? There is another purpose to the play, the play is designed to be on film to make the DE stay at home, and crash the running plays from behind.

Showing a play like this every once in the while makes the defenses aware of it and makes them think. That split second they are having to think maybe all the OL needs to spring the RB for a big a gain on the spread play.

Calling plays in the NFL is like a chess match, you show a certain move early in order to set up another move later.

[Roy P]

It would be nice if our 'setup' play was still good for averaging 3 positive yards.

[Bigtinylittle]

You do know that the reverse is not designed to work every time, right? There is another purpose to the play, the play is designed to be on film to make the DE stay at home, and crash the running plays from behind.

Showing a play like this every once in the while makes the defenses aware of it and makes them think. That split second they are having to think maybe all the OL needs to spring the RB for a big a gain on the spread play.

Calling plays in the NFL is like a chess match, you show a certain move early in order to set up another move later.

That's exactly right and it's one of the reasons I almost never criticise an individual play call by any coach.

[chuck]

It would be nice if our 'setup' play was still good for averaging 3 positive yards.

Right. Hey, I got an idea! Let's run a play that's almost sure to lose 8 yards so we can make the DE stay at home and maybe pick up four later in the game!

[painekiller]

Right. Hey, I got an idea! Let's run a play that's almost sure to lose 8 yards so we can make the DE stay at home and maybe pick up four later in the game!

It's not about gaining the 4 yds later, it about the play action roll out deep pass to AJ or Jacoby for a TD. The play also makes the Safeties have to stay at home. This is a well crafted offense, even if most of the fans do not understand that.

[chuck]

This is a well crafted offense, even if most of the fans do not understand that.

Get back to me on this when the team shows some production in the red zone rather than anemic two-back sets and halfback passes.

[Joshua]

It's not about gaining the 4 yds later, it about the play action roll out deep pass to AJ or Jacoby for a TD. The play also makes the Safeties have to stay at home. This is a well crafted offense, even if most of the fans do not understand that.

While I get your point, I took Bob's point to be more about the personnel the Texans use for this play rather than the play itself. Also, I'm certain there must be a play beside an end-around with Kevin Walter that can keep a DE at home.

That said, it is a fairly well designed offense, but let's not go overboard. I think it's a mistake to read some misunderstood genius in every play Kubiak calls. Sometimes, it's just a bad playcall. At the end of the day, this offense is still middle of the pack when it comes to what matters-scoring points.

[barrett]

While I get your point, I took Bob's point to be more about the personnel the Texans use for this play rather than the play itself. Also, I'm certain there must be a play beside an end-around with Kevin Walter that can keep a DE at home.

That said, it is a fairly well designed offense, but let's not go overboard. I think it's a mistake to read some misunderstood genius in every play Kubiak calls. Sometimes, it's just a bad playcall. At the end of the day, this offense is still middle of the pack when it comes to what matters-scoring points.

The Texans were 10th in scoring offense last year. That's not the middle of the pack.

As for the reverse to Walter. Walter has averaged 6 ypc in his career (higher the last two years). AJ has averaged 1.2 ypc. JJ 2.3 ypc. And AD 3.6 ypc.

So my guess is that calling that play is a bad play call. We have never run it well and none of our guys have had any success with it. And we already run the bootleg great and that keeps the DE home. And the end around doesn't help the bootleg at all. The end around is a wasted play.

But Bob's crusade against Walter is more about the "white boy" part then about the "reverse" part since Walter has run it better than the rest of our guys.

[HPF Bob]

What makes any bootleg or rollout work is play action, not reverses. If we ran the ball more effectively, the end would have no choice but to respect it.

As for Walter having a higher success rate than the others, I presume it has to do with more opportunities. Besides, when Walter runs it, the defense has to stop laughing long enough to make the tackle.

If Walter is our best blocking receiver, as I hear told, then it makes less sense to have him running the play instead of blocking in front of it.

[edo783]

Back to the topic. Yes, the spin does have issues, but not so much for being catchable or not. If you watch a QBs throw down the sideline more than say 20 yards, you will notice the ball move either towards the sideline or towards the field depending on whether it is the left or right side of the field and whether it is a left or right handed thrower. The rotational spin causes the ball to move sort of like a baseball does when thrown. I have seen it move what looks like a foot or more on longer throws. The spin will also help it stay on track better in crosse winds, depending on what direction they are coming from. However, a tight spiral seems to have as much or even more to do with keeping it on track in wind.

[barrett]

What makes any bootleg or rollout work is play action, not reverses. If we ran the ball more effectively, the end would have no choice but to respect it.

As for Walter having a higher success rate than the others, I presume it has to do with more opportunities. Besides, when Walter runs it, the defense has to stop laughing long enough to make the tackle.

If Walter is our best blocking receiver, as I hear told, then it makes less sense to have him running the play instead of blocking in front of it.

I agree about playaction and bootlegs being key to the run game rather than the reverse.

But say what you want about opportunities (and AJ has had more than KW), say what you want about blocking, the bottom line is that Walter has been better on that play than any WR we have. So complain about the play call and not Walter.

[Nconroe]

Well, a few very successful QB's have been left handed such as Steve Young, Kenny Stabler, Boomer Esiason, to name a few. So, maybe Leinert can get there. But left handed QB are pretty rare in NFL overall.

As I think I understand spin on the ball, spin will cause the ball to change trajectory slightly off the straight line in direction of the spin and thus the drag of ball may cause some drift in that direction, as will wind speed and speed of the ball thrown over a distance, and delivery mechanics of the throw.

[chuck]

But Bob's crusade against Walter is more about the "white boy" part then about the "reverse" part since Walter has run it better than the rest of our guys.

Bob dislikes white people. Huh. Who knew?

edo - that's an interesting observation. I'd never thought of that but I can see plainly that a ball could drift due to spin on some longer throws. I've never noticed this when I'm fooling around with a football but then again I can't throw a ball 60 yards either. Not usually.

[popanot]

Calling plays in the NFL is like a chess match, you show a certain move early in order to set up another move later.Then please explain the 2-yards and a cloud-of-dust flare to (even slower than a white-boy) Leach they so love to run. Do they run other plays to setup that big gainer, or, do they run that play to setup other big plays? ;) For some reason that play never seems to keep defenses off-balance. :p

[barrett]

Bob dislikes white people. Huh. Who knew?

edo - that's an interesting observation. I'd never thought of that but I can see plainly that a ball could drift due to spin on some longer throws. I've never noticed this when I'm fooling around with a football but then again I can't throw a ball 60 yards either. Not usually.

I bet he likes them just fine.

A failed play with a white guy is just more memorable than all the times that play failed with AJ and JJ.

[barrett]

Then please explain the 2-yards and a cloud-of-dust flare to (even slower than a white-boy) Leach they so love to run. Do they run other plays to setup that big gainer, or, do they run that play to setup other big plays? ;) For some reason that play never seems to keep defenses off-balance. :p

The reverse is bad, but the flare to leach really is a good play. That pass being thrown means Schaub has gone through all of his progressions and has NOBODY else open. No way is Schaub throwing to him by choice. That play is about getting the ball out.

[painekiller]

Then please explain the 2-yards and a cloud-of-dust flare to (even slower than a white-boy) Leach they so love to run. Do they run other plays to setup that big gainer, or, do they run that play to setup other big plays? ;) For some reason that play never seems to keep defenses off-balance. :p

Believe it or not that play has to be run a few times a year, to keep defenses honest.

That is straight from a Bill Walsh's mouth. A few years ago they ran great film on Walsh and the WCO. They had clips from the hours of tape the 49ers have of Walsh talking WCO offensive. He talked about the reason you run plays that only get a yard or two. Everything has a purpose.

Kubiak's first order of business when hired by the 49ers to be QB coach way back in the day, was to watch all 200 hours of Walsh's tapes. That is how every 49ers offensive assistant was taught. At least until last season, not sure about the current guys.

[Fonz the Boss]

Then please explain the 2-yards and a cloud-of-dust flare to (even slower than a white-boy) Leach they so love to run. Do they run other plays to setup that big gainer, or, do they run that play to setup other big plays? ;) For some reason that play never seems to keep defenses off-balance. :p

Is that the play that came in handy against the Packers a couple years back? It was a big gainer on the game winning drive.

[Keith]

The reverse is bad, but the flare to leach really is a good play. That pass being thrown means Schaub has gone through all of his progressions and has NOBODY else open. No way is Schaub throwing to him by choice. That play is about getting the ball out.
Yeah. That's the hope, and Schaub is good enough to make me believe it.

There are plenty of Checkdown Charlie's in the league though that I doubt go through their progressions enough.... David Carr, Trent Edwards, uhm Matt Leinart, and so on. Eh, I knock the FB checkdown, but it serves a purpose if used sparingly. Hopefully it allows Leach to unload on a CB at least.

[Keith]

chron has Leinart's contact details, including a noteworthy bit about Dan Orlovsky agreeing to a paycut.
Leinart signed a one-year contract for $630,000. He can earn $23,125 for every game he’s designated as the No. 2 quarterback. His contract maxes out at $1 million.

Orlovsky's restructured deal calls for him to make a base salary of $850,000 — a reduction from $2.25 million. He can make up the difference by earning $25,000 for every game he's the No. 2 quarterback.

Orlovsky also can earn $100,000 for every game he's the starting quarterback — a maximum of 10 games and $1 million.

In 2011, Orlovsky was scheduled to earn $2.75 mllion. Instead, he receives a base salary of $1.375 million. He can earn that back if he's No. 2 for one game this season. He will be the No. 2 quarterback for Sunday’s game against Indianapolis, which means he won’t be taking a cut in pay next year.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/7192079.html

[chuck]

chron has Leinart's contact details, including a noteworthy bit about Dan Orlovsky agreeing to a paycut.

Wow. Rick Smith is earning his money.

[Joshua]

chron has Leinart's contact details, including a noteworthy bit about Dan Orlovsky agreeing to a paycut.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/7192079.html

Reading between the lines, it sounds like Orlovsky was given the option of a reduced salary or the highway. Apparently, he concluded the reduced salary was better than anything he could get on the open market in September.

[nunusguy]

Reading between the lines, it sounds like Orlovsky was given the option of a reduced salary or the highway. Apparently, he concluded the reduced salary was better than anything he could get on the open market in September.
Which begs the question, if the Texans were willing to cut DanO and eat the guaranteed money, why didn't they just do so and retain Booty as their backup ?

[Joshua]

Which begs the question, if the Texans were willing to cut DanO and eat the guaranteed money, why didn't they just do so and retain Booty as their backup ?

While we are clearly just speculating about all of this at this point, my guess would be that Booty's lack of experience kept this from happening. I think Kubiak just couldn't pull the trigger on going into the season with someone as inexperienced as Booty as the back-up. For good or bad, Orlovsky at least has started/played in a fair amount of games in the league.

[Joshua]

I should also add that it reads as though the restructuring came after the signing of Leinart. So, it sounds to me like they were willing to pay Orlovsky when it was just between him and Booty, but when Leinart became available for cheap, they went back to Orlovsky with the restructured deal.