Faneca on the Radar?

[popanot]

Wouldn't be a bad signing on the cheap...


Posted by Mike Florio on April 25, 2010 6:49 PM ET
With veteran Pro Bowl guard Alan Faneca now available, count the Texans among the potential suitors. According to John McClain of the Houston Chronicle, the teams is "checking out" the former Steeler and Jet.

McClain points out that Faneca went to high school outside Houston, which could make a return to the area more attractive.

He's owed $5.25 million in guaranteed money from the Jets, which could make him more inclined to play for the veteran minimum. Then again, it's still an uncapped year -- and if two or more teams are interested Faneca could spark an auction. Besides, we reported on Saturday that Faneca was cut after he refused to take a pay cut. If he wanted to make something at or close to the veteran minimum, he could have simply stayed in New York.

So whether it's the Texans or the Bears or the Cardinals or someone else, look for Faneca to do better than the bottom dollar to which he'd be entitled under the labor agreement.

[HPF Bob]

Interesting. As long he can execute the blocking scheme, I think he'd be a big addition, especially in terms of attitude.

[NBT]

AT 33 years of age Faneca may be approaching that time in his life where he just can't take the rigors of an NFL life.

[Joe Joe]

Imagine how you would feel if Amobi got 6.5 sacks. Now take that feeling and reverse it. That is how you shoul feel about acquiring a guard who blocks the run well, but gave up 6.5 sacks.

[Nconroe]

I found this interesting, by sacks allowed Texans had fifth best OL in 2009-10.
We also had pretty near the youngest line of all teams.

Jets, where Faneca comes from, allowed more sacks and passed a lot less.

Of course they ran the ball more effectively. Scheme or personnel?

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?archive=false&conference=null&role=TM&offensiveStatisticCategory=OFFENSIVE_LINE&defensiveStatisticCategory=null&season=2009&seasonType=REG&tabSeq=2&qualified=true&Submit=Go

Teams who allowed the fewest sacks at the end of the regular season
Indianapolis Colts 13 sacks allowed pass 63% of their plays run 37% of their plays
Tennessee Titans 15 sacks allowed pass 50% of their plays run 50% of their plays
New England Patriots 18 sacks allowed pass 57% of their plays run 43% of their plays
New Orleans Saints 20 sacks allowed pass 55% of their plays run 45% of their plays
Houston Texans 25 sacks allowed pass 60% of their plays run 40% of their plays
San Diego Chargers 25 sacks allowed pass 57% of their plays run 43% of their plays
Arizona Cardinals 26 sacks allowed pass 62% of their plays run 38% of their plays
Atlanta Falcons 27 sacks allowed pass 57% of their plays run 43% of their plays
Cincinnati Bengals 29 sacks allowed pass 51% of their plays run 49% of their plays
New York Jets 30 sacks allowed pass 42% of their plays run 58% of their plays
Cleveland Browns 30 sacks allowed pass 49% of their plays run 51% of their plays
New York Giants 32 sacks allowed pass 57% of their plays run 43% of their plays
Carolina Panthers 32 sacks allowed pass 49% of their plays run 51% of their plays
Miami Dolphins 33 sacks allowed pass 54% of their plays run 46% of their plays
Tampa Bay Buccaneers 33 sacks allowed pass 58% of their plays run 42% of their plays
Dallas Cowboys 34 sacks allowed pass 58% of their plays run 42% of their plays
Minnesota Vikings 34 sacks allowed pass 56% of their plays run 42% of their plays
Denver Broncos 34 sacks allowed pass 58% of their plays run 42% of their plays
Chicago Bears 35 sacks allowed pass 62% of their plays run 38% of their plays
Baltimore Ravens 36 sacks allowed pass 54% of their plays run 46% of their plays
Philadelphia Eagles 38 sacks allowed pass 61% of their plays run 39% of their plays
San Francisco 49ers 40 sacks allowed pass 61% of their plays run 39% of their plays
Seattle Seahawks 41 sacks allowed pass 63% of their plays run 37% of their plays
Jacksonville Jaguars 42 sacks allowed pass 54% of their plays run 44% of their plays
Kansas City Chiefs 42 sacks allowed pass 58% of their plays run 42% of their plays
St. Louis Rams 44 sacks allowed pass 59% of their plays run 41% of their plays
Washington Redskins 45 sacks allowed pass 60% of their plays run 40% of their plays
Buffalo Bills 46 sacks allowed pass 54% of their plays run 46% of their plays
Detroit Lions 47 sacks allowed pass 61% of their plays run 39% of their plays
Oakland Raiders 49 sacks allowed pass 57% of their plays run 43% of their plays
Pittsburgh Steelers 50 sacks allowed pass 58% of their plays run 42% of their plays
Green Bay Packers 51 sacks allowed pass 58% of their plays run 42% of their plays

[WMH]

Imagine how you would feel if Amobi got 6.5 sacks. Now take that feeling and reverse it. That is how you shoul feel about acquiring a guard who blocks the run well, but gave up 6.5 sacks.

My personal opinion, that is a loaded stat. I would put Schaub and our recievers up against Sanchez and the Jets receivers 7 days a week. Linemen get "blamed" for sacks even though it is not always thier fault. QB hangs onto the ball too long, coverage sacks, etc.

The dude, even at 33 is a baller, and would give us the type of push we need up the middle to score from the damn 1 yard line. If he gives up a sack once every four games, but lets Tate run thru 4 times from the 1, we win in that signing.

Just my thoughts.

[Joshua]

While the money probably has to be right, I don't see any downside to this and it has the potential to be a significant upgrade. Quite frankly, after trotting out Myers, Studdard, etc. last year, it boggles my mind that people think someone like Faneca can't help this team. If someone like Faneca isn't worth considering, I'm honestly curious as to who would be. Sure there are some minor concerns but anyone who gets cut will have something you can point to, otherwise they wouldn't be cut. However, it ain't like if we just wait long enough someone will cut a 26 year old pro bowler with a mean streak on the field and a heart of gold off it.

[HPF Bob]

My personal opinion, that is a loaded stat. I would put Schaub and our recievers up against Sanchez and the Jets receivers 7 days a week. Linemen get "blamed" for sacks even though it is not always thier fault. QB hangs onto the ball too long, coverage sacks, etc.

The dude, even at 33 is a baller, and would give us the type of push we need up the middle to score from the damn 1 yard line. If he gives up a sack once every four games, but lets Tate run thru 4 times from the 1, we win in that signing.

Just my thoughts.

Faneca was protecting a rookie quarterback in a "don't lose the game for us" offense. I would presume Sanchez held onto the ball too long at times and was told not to throw a pick at all costs at others. I wouldn't get too worked up over the Jets' sack totals last season.

And I agree that we need two guys we can run behind in this line that can get us the tough yard on third-and-one or third-and-goal. Don't care which two guys those are but we weren't getting any surge most of the year when we needed it most.

[Big Texas]

Anyway you look at this, Faneca would be an upgrade for our Oline. Not to mention veteran leadership for Caldwell.

[Bigtinylittle]

I agree that Schaub had a lot to do with that number. Unlike HWWNBN, Schaub is very good at finding open receivers. He rarely pulls the ball down. Also, he's not afraid to just throw the ball away. In a strange way, his lack of mobility has been an asset. It has forced him to learn to get rid of the ball.

[Roy P]

My personal opinion, that is a loaded stat.
Just my thoughts.

The Jets ran 1047 plays and the Texans ran 1063 plays. Not all plays are created equal. Some teams are more likely to pass on 3rd and 5 than others, thus defenses more likely to blitz those teams. Now, over the duration of a season, we may find an equalization of those situations. Just crunching the numbers.....

The Jets were sacked 2.86% of their plays.
The Texans were sacked 2.35% of theirs.

I'll take the guy who has gone to Pro-Bowls and can create holes to run through over Studdard.

[Joe Joe]

I'll take the guy who has gone to Pro-Bowls and can create holes to run through over Studdard.

Very similar logic got the Texans Ahman Green....

Faneca accounted for over 20% of their sacks allowed and he has the same rookie QB that the rest of the Jets line had to deal with. I'm hopeful that Tate will start at RB. Having a guard weak at pass blocking may make the Texans less willing to let Tate learn pass blocking on the job.

I'd have no problem getting Faneca at league minimum, but would probably only use him in short yardage situations.

[Joshua]

Couple of points, I'm confused by the insinuation that 20% represents some excessive percentage. An offensive line is 5 guys so if they each gave up the same amount of sacks, each would be responsible for 20%. Not sure how you concluded that 20% was some out of proportion amount.

As others have pointed out (and as us Texans fans should be painfully aware), there are many reasons for sacks to occur and I think it is somewhat simplistic to just pull up his sacks allowed and base an opinion on that. For instance, I pulled up Steve Hutchinson (generally considered the best guard in football) and here are his career sacks allowed -

2001 7.00
2002 0.00 (only played 4 games)
2003 5.00
2004 3.00
2005 1.25
2006 4.50
2007 3.00
2008 7.00
2009 3.50

Even Hutchinson has averaged over 4 sacks allowed per year for his career and gave up 7 2 years ago. I hope Steve Hutchinson would still be on most people's radar even after giving up 7 sacks in 2008.

Although I admit it is little more than a popularity contest, Faneca is a multiple pro bowler, and I've never heard anyone say that Faneca is not an above average, if not elite, guard. While I might not want to break the bank for him, I can't see how anyone can argue that he simply doesn't have enough on-the-field ability to challenge even Kasey Studdard.

And I think the Ahman Green analogy is misplaced. Green was a known injury risk as well as over-the-hill. It was a calculated risk that failed but I think most people knew that risk was there. Faneca, on the other hand, is only 33 and offensive linemen are often productive into their mid, if not late, 30s. Just don't see the comparison unless you think anyone we consider over the age of 30 can be stuck with the "very similar logic got the Texans Ahman Green" card.

[barrett]

If the money is right this is a no brainer. And as long as no long term committment is required in the form of gauranteed money counting towards future years, I would even pay him well this year.

The beauty of the NFL is that you send them all to training camp and let them determine who the best player is. Just like when we signed Roosevelt Colvin a few years ago. As long as you are not putting a long term committment out there you always bring in the vet. Then you hope the young guys are good enough to beat him out, and if they aren't you have improved your team.

The Ahman Green signing was far different in that it was early in FA and it falsely convinced the Texans they could stand pat at RB through the remainder of FA and the draft. This signing would come after all of our moves and it didn't keep us from making other moves at guard.

[nunusguy]

Alan Faneca if signed would replace Studdard and play left guard, that's the plan ? Oh and this is off the topic, but I've always wondered why our least athletic guard plays the position generally acknowledged to be the more athletically demanding position ( between left & rfight guard ) ?
So anyway the scenario with Faneca at LG has who at the remaining 2 interior OLine positions among Briesel (assuming he's fully recovered from injury), Wade Smith, Myers, and Caldwell with the understanding that Smith & Caldwell can play either center or RG ?

[Nconroe]

I'd go along with Barrett's scenario, invite him in to camp, offer him a good salary if he makes it through training camp.

There are definitely references out there saying he has lost a step and has not pass protected as well as he used to, but run blocking is still considered top notch.

on the math/statistics -
Texans passed 60% of their 1062 plays which is 637 plays you can get sacked on. overall Texans allowed 25 sacks and Studdard allowed 5 of these.
so Studdard allowed 637/5 or 1 sack every 127 pass plays, not bad.

Jets passed on 42% of 1047 plays which is 439 pass plays. overall Jets allowed 30 sacks and Faneca allowed 7 of those. so Faneca allowed 439/7 or 1 sack every 62 pass plays.

if you were to compare the 2009 numbers - Faneca allowed more than double the sacks as Studdard per pass play.

if we are a passing team first, might not be such a great idea.

[TexanJedi]

I would rather bring back (health pending) Chester Pitts. Although Faneca might be able to bring something in terms of attitude and experience.

[Joshua]

Texans passed 60% of their 1062 plays which is 637 plays you can get sacked on. overall Texans allowed 25 sacks and Studdard allowed 5 of these.
so Studdard allowed 637/5 or 1 sack every 127 pass plays, not bad.

Jets passed on 42% of 1047 plays which is 439 pass plays. overall Jets allowed 30 sacks and Faneca allowed 7 of those. so Faneca allowed 439/7 or 1 sack every 62 pass plays.

if you were to compare the 2009 numbers - Faneca allowed more than double the sacks as Studdard per pass play.



Without rehashing earlier comments, sacks allowed has many moving parts beside the lineman and it's difficult to draw definitive conclusions about each lineman's play from this.

Secondly, these numbers are meaningless unless you know how many of these snaps Faneca and Studdard played. I know we didn't start the year with Studdard in the starting lineup so your numbers need to be adjusted for the actual snaps Studdard played.

[Joshua]

Another thing to consider. The Jets offensive line is generally considered to be one of the best in the league. Yet, not just Faneca but their line as a whole gave up more sacks than the Texans' line despite fewer passing attempts. Seems as though you can draw one of two conclusions from this. One, the Texans actually had a better OL than the Jets (at least at pass protecting), or two, some other factors were contributing to the Jets' sack total. I think you would be hardpressed to find anyone in the NFL who would take last year's Texan OL over the Jets OL, so I'm inclined to go with No. 2.

[painekiller]

According the the NFLnetwork guy, the one that used to be the GM of the Raiders forget his name, the front runner is the Browns and Eric Mangini was the HC that signed Faneca to the huge deal and would be happy to have him again.

Plus they are reporting that Faneca will not take a cut in pay but wants to double dip as much as he can from this season.

Good bye Texans. They are trying the Drayton McLane school of signing a FAQ, offer him less the the other teams and beg him to come play for you.

[Nconroe]

I did say bring him in and see what happens, not unusual to do this.

Kasey Studdard started 14 games and played in all 16 in 2009, his first year to start. I'm not saying can't improve Texans OL either, just saying need to do the OTA's, training camp, see who you drafted, check the FA's, looks like several others will become available, then have a great 2010 season. Lots of factors why Texans didn't run well either.

So, two to one sacks allowed, no matter the reasons, and I think in NY they thought it was because Faneca was getting old and lost a step or two is quite a difference from one position, otherwise why release him.

Overall Jets line, for run game , obviously maybe the best as a unit. They had much more experience and years together than the Texans OL as well. They are trying to get better for pass as well.

[NBT]

The way I read it is, Faneca is 33, he is still good on run plays but he gave up 6.5 sacks last year. Based on that I would say we wouldn't be any better off with Faneca than we are right now with Studdard.

[Warren]

Faneca has agreed to terms with the Cardinals (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5140938) -- one year, $2.5 million gauranteed base with a $300k signing bonus and a $100k workout bonus. He'll be reunited with Ken Whisenhunt and Russ Grimm, who also coached him in Pittsburgh.

[WMH]

Faneca has agreed to terms with the Cardinals (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5140938) -- one year, $2.5 million gauranteed base with a $300k signing bonus and a $100k workout bonus. He'll be reunited with Ken Whisenhunt and Russ Grimm, who also coached him in Pittsburgh.

Well, crap.....Now what are we going to talk about :(

[Roy P]

Well, crap.....Now what are we going to talk about :(

John Henderson? :confused:

Aaron Sears?

[painekiller]

John Henderson? :confused:

Aaron Sears?

Or Sharper...

[Joe Joe]

Couple of points, I'm confused by the insinuation that 20% represents some excessive percentage. An offensive line is 5 guys so if they each gave up the same amount of sacks, each would be responsible for 20%. Not sure how you concluded that 20% was some out of proportion amount.

As others have pointed out (and as us Texans fans should be painfully aware), there are many reasons for sacks to occur and I think it is somewhat simplistic to just pull up his sacks allowed and base an opinion on that. For instance, I pulled up Steve Hutchinson (generally considered the best guard in football) and here are his career sacks allowed -

2001 7.00
2002 0.00 (only played 4 games)
2003 5.00
2004 3.00
2005 1.25
2006 4.50
2007 3.00
2008 7.00
2009 3.50

Even Hutchinson has averaged over 4 sacks allowed per year for his career and gave up 7 2 years ago. I hope Steve Hutchinson would still be on most people's radar even after giving up 7 sacks in 2008.

Although I admit it is little more than a popularity contest, Faneca is a multiple pro bowler, and I've never heard anyone say that Faneca is not an above average, if not elite, guard. While I might not want to break the bank for him, I can't see how anyone can argue that he simply doesn't have enough on-the-field ability to challenge even Kasey Studdard.

And I think the Ahman Green analogy is misplaced. Green was a known injury risk as well as over-the-hill. It was a calculated risk that failed but I think most people knew that risk was there. Faneca, on the other hand, is only 33 and offensive linemen are often productive into their mid, if not late, 30s. Just don't see the comparison unless you think anyone we consider over the age of 30 can be stuck with the "very similar logic got the Texans Ahman Green" card.

I would expect the tackles to have a greater percentage of sacks allowed than the interior linemen. Also, I expect some sacks allowed may be charged to RBs even though I'm not positive on that. The Jets released Faneca and it wasn't cheap for them to do so. A pro bowl offensive linemen just doesn't get released unless he's getting a little long in the tooth.

The Jets released Faneca. Why haven't the Texans done great at free agency. NFL teams, for the most part, are not stupid and do not let good players go to free agency unless the salary cap forces their hand. The Jets aren't stupid and Faneca can run block.

If the Texans offensive line sucked, Faneca might make more sense. The Texans offensive line is very good in pass protection, but have appeared to suck at run blocking.

I do find it odd at how chill Kubiak and Smith have been about the interior line and free safety, but they practically had airplanes flying over the draft saying "The Texans will pick RB and CB in the first two rounds". The Texans must be impressed with the learning curve of Studdard and Caldwell. Also, if I remember correctly...Winston stuck up for Meyers about getting pushed around by Jenkins saying he wasn't the one at fault. Pitts got cut...

[Joshua]

Or Sharper...

Interesting thought. There is no question that he made an enormous impact on the Saints last year and I'm not sure they win the Super Bowl without him. Savvy veteran leadership for a relatively young secondary. Having said that, I think it's fairly clear the Texans aren't in the market for guys like this. While I understand you can go overboard compiling big name players on the decline, a la the Redskins, I do think there is something to be said for taking a guy or two like that as stop-gap measures at positions of need, particularly when you think you are positioned to challenge for the playoffs. I think it is pretty clear the Texans don't feel this way though so all this talk is probably just that--talk.

[Joe Joe]

Interesting thought. There is no question that he made an enormous impact on the Saints last year and I'm not sure they win the Super Bowl without him. Savvy veteran leadership for a relatively young secondary. Having said that, I think it's fairly clear the Texans aren't in the market for guys like this. While I understand you can go overboard compiling big name players on the decline, a la the Redskins, I do think there is something to be said for taking a guy or two like that as stop-gap measures at positions of need, particularly when you think you are positioned to challenge for the playoffs. I think it is pretty clear the Texans don't feel this way though so all this talk is probably just that--talk.

Definitely agree. I would also add that I don't think the Texans feel there is anything wrong with the safeties. I've heard them say good things about Pollard, Wilson, and Barber. My guess is that Wilson is their saavy veteran.

[painekiller]

Definitely agree. I would also add that I don't think the Texans feel there is anything wrong with the safeties. I've heard them say good things about Pollard, Wilson, and Barber. My guess is that Wilson is their saavy veteran.

What they say in public at a press conference and what they really think are two different things in many cases.

[Nconroe]

What they say in public at a press conference and what they really think are two different things in many cases.

Agree with that for sure. I guess they are always looking to upgrade but stay in their long term plan for now and build some consistency as well.

Here is a pretty recent list of FA available today by position.
http://www.profootballweekly.com/2010/04/24/2010-free-agent-list-by-position

[NBT]

I think we'er making a mountain out of a mole-hill.

[Joshua]

What they say in public at a press conference and what they really think are two different things in many cases.

While I agree with this generally, their actions regarding the safety position seem to suggest that their public comments mirror their private ones. They never make any significant attempts to upgrade the position. Remember last year they claimed they were satisfied with their safeties and backed up these public comments by going into the regular season with absolute garbage at the safety position. By doing that, I gotta think they actually thought they were good at safety and it wasn't just PR. It was only after they were torched the first couple of games that they showed any indication that maybe they needed to look for someone to bring in. Luckily, Pollard fell into their laps.

[Roy P]

Here is a pretty recent list of FA available today by position.
http://www.profootballweekly.com/2010/04/24/2010-free-agent-list-by-position

Could somebody talk to me about Arron Sears and Tampa Bay. I thought he was pretty good there, and they just cut him. Is he injured? Any thoughts on bringing him in?

As for bringing in Veteran savvy and leadership. Keith Bulluck should be able to take the job from Zach Diles. Perhaps his agent is asking for $4Mil per year or something, but I'd be ok for 2 years at that price.

I wanted to draft Jeremy Thompson to play DE opposite of Mario. The Packers drafted him and now he is mis-cast as a 3/4 OLB. He is an Unrestricted FA and should be cheap. I understand that we have Barwin and Smith already, but is having 4 pass-rushing DE's on the roster a bad thing? Isn't that how the Giants won the SuperBowl a couple of years ago?

That's all I got.

[Roy P]

Could somebody talk to me about Arron Sears and Tampa Bay. I thought he was pretty good there, and they just cut him. Is he injured? Any thoughts on bringing him in?


It looks like he is going through 'personal problems' off the field. So, that is probably with the Bucs cut him and why we won't sign him.

http://www.tampabay.com/sports/football/bucs/article1021165.ece

http://www.tampabay.com/sports/football/bucs/article1007440.ece

[painekiller]

Darren Sharper is who I would go get. He would be the best Safety we have had, and IMO he would help us storm into the playoffs.

[bono]

I wanted to draft Jeremy Thompson to play DE opposite of Mario. The Packers drafted him and now he is mis-cast as a 3/4 OLB. He is an Unrestricted FA and should be cheap. I understand that we have Barwin and Smith already, but is having 4 pass-rushing DE's on the roster a bad thing? Isn't that how the Giants won the SuperBowl a couple of years ago?

That's all I got.

Jeremy Thompson is retiring due to injury

[Roy P]

Jeremy Thompson is retiring due to injury

Wow! That really sucks. He was like the definition of what I wanted from a LDE in terms of measureables. Guess he just never had a chance to develop and now an injury. Very young to have to retire due to injury. :(

[bckey]

While I agree with this generally, their actions regarding the safety position seem to suggest that their public comments mirror their private ones. They never make any significant attempts to upgrade the position. Remember last year they claimed they were satisfied with their safeties and backed up these public comments by going into the regular season with absolute garbage at the safety position. By doing that, I gotta think they actually thought they were good at safety and it wasn't just PR. It was only after they were torched the first couple of games that they showed any indication that maybe they needed to look for someone to bring in. Luckily, Pollard fell into their laps.


I've brought this same issue up on another board when the Texans negleted the fs position in this years draft. I hope Kubiak isn't just so stubborn that it clouds his judgement. Counting on Eugene Wilson after he has missed so many games due to injury over the last 3 seasons just doesn't make good sense. FS has been the single most neglected position on the team since its inception.

[Nconroe]

I thought they should perhaps draft a FS prior to UDFA as well.

Last year they were very bad the first 3-4 games, but defense got a lot better last 12 or so games, so maybe need this year is not quite as bad as last year this time.

I guess they like Eugene Wilson and Dominick Barber plus a draft pick from last year should all be healthy this year. They have quite a few DB on roster now, so perhaps we have some good backup to Wilson should he be injured again.

Then, there is still a long while till Sept. to pick up a FS via free agency should a good one come along.